Cleaning hard water (lime?) deposits from boat (Powell)

S

Sunbeam

Active member
Boating on Powell is great, but my (formerly) clean, shiny boat is developing a white crusty exterior, and from a little searching I've done (slow connection) it may be a challenge to remove. It seems abrasive, so I am not keen to "rub" on it to remove it. I've read quite a few suggestions via Google, but many of them are mainly about soap scum (which apparently is attracted to the hard water deposits on shower stalls) and not the underlying lime, or they are about small areas - not whole boats.

Seems I should try to get the boat clean as soon as I can after getting off the lake, so I figured I'd ask you all who have boated here (or on other hard water lakes) before. What have you used that has worked well to clean the boat? What didn't work or caused other damage (would sure like to avoid that). I can order something now, if need be, and have it waiting for me when I retrieve at Wahweap. (Funny, I asked one of the Hall's people about it and they looked at me like "hard water deposits? Here?")

I searched the archives here but only found mention of it as applied to motor cowlings (but I have limited connection ability here). I've seen some really clean shiny C-Dorys that I know have been on Powell in the past, so there must be some good methods/products.

Thanks,
Sunbeam
 
Those products used to remove soap scum should work, if they contain sulfamic acid. Typically sold in a spray bottle. If you let them sit on the hull for fifteen minutes or so, it will help dissolve the hard water deposit. I checked the label on what we have, and it is rated for use on fiberglass surfaces. We have used this stuff for years on our FG shower and bath installations, with no loss of shine.

Try some on a small area and make sure it does not destroy the shine. Shouldn't hurt it at all, but testing is best.[/b]
 
Just regular vinegar straight from the bottle has always done the trick for Still Crazy after being on Powell for a while. The stores also sell bottles of "extra strength" vinegar just for such cleaning tasks. I wipe it on and let it set for a minute, and then stuff pretty much just wipes off. If there is a tough spot, use some more vinegar a few times. Environmental friendly and cheap and it works.
 
Either Vinegar or CLR should work fine. (The White Vinegar should be cheaper) But frankly we have never worried about it--even after a month on the lake. We washed down the boat when we got home, and then waxed it. The boat is going to get dirty on the road, and you have a chance of tar, bugs, and all sorts of other material getting on it. After all it is a boat!
 
thataway":1whgwaia said:
Either Vinegar or CLR should work fine. (The White Vinegar should be cheaper) But frankly we have never worried about it--even after a month on the lake. We washed down the boat when we got home, and then waxed it. The boat is going to get dirty on the road, and you have a chance of tar, bugs, and all sorts of other material getting on it. After all it is a boat!
Click to expand...

Good advice there.

Enjoy,

Harvey
SleepyC :moon
 
Thanks for all the input. I'm not so much worried as just would like to use the most efficient way to remove the deposits, which are a white "crust" that seem somewhat abrasive (if just wiped). After a bit of Googling, I got the impression that the deposits were a challenge to remove, so that's why I figured I'd see what folks here had done that worked (or did not work). I like how we can build on the knowledge/experience of others here :thup These deposits seem different from the dirt/bugs/etc. I get when trailering, and/or the salt water "stuff," (both of which I'm more used to).

Still reading along if anyone has further comments.
 
Vinegar should work. Wipe some on and let it sit 15 minutes. It will not hurt the glass. Also, any of the bathtub and shower stall cleaner sprays from the household section at the grocery store based on sulfamic acid will also work. Read the label and reassure yourself it is recommended for fiberglass.

Use a soft, wet sponge to remove the stuff, rinsing the sponge in fresh water each wipe, and shoild come up clean.

Those deposits are carbonates from the hard water you were on, mixed with some algae and a little sediment. The very mild acids in vinegar, and the mild acid sulfamic acid will, dissolve the stuff. Hydrochloric acid, diluted down, will also remove the stuff, but is too strong. The vinegar and the aulfamic acid product should not affect your trailer, if rinsed off thoroughly. Hydrochloric acid will corrode the metal if allowed to remIn one the metal.
 
I thought I would follow up after having cleaned the boat. It was absolutely caked with hard water deposits (like a white "crust" of sorts). After reading here (and on the web), we loaded up on possible cleaners at Wal-Mart and then proceeded to the car wash, where we experimented on small areas first.

Boat soap and water... ha ha. No. (I believe I heard the hard water deposits pointing and laughing.)

Very diluted cleaning vinegar in water... not so much.

Borax we had along but did not end up using (or even trying).

What ended up working (and seemingly similarly effective) was two things (used separately - just one or the other):

1) A mixture of about 50/50 cleaning vinegar and water, with some blue Dawn dish soap added (we fully accepted that this would probably be removing prior wax, and so planned to re-wax).

2) Lime-Away cleaner (which, from what I can tell did contain sulfamic acid). Note that to find out one has to get online and find the MSDS, as virtually none of these types of cleaners listed on the container what was in them (annoyingly, as we had to make a second trip after researching online).

The Lime-Away said not to use it on "metallics." Although that seemed a bit vague to me (I would call metal "metal" and wondered if "metallic" meant metal or rather things that look like metal or have some metal in them - such as metallic paint). It also said not to use it on painted surfaces.

For that reason I only used it on the topsides (i.e. sides of hull below the rubrail), and I made sure to rinse the trailer, etc. with plenty of water. I didn't use it near the engines, glass, or window frames.

I think the vinegar mixture worked just as well, and we did use that for the majority of the boat. It had the advantage of also cleaning dirt (because of the soap).

As recommended above, we used a couple of big, soft sponges and had pails of clean water to rinse them with. We also made good use of a couple of "Absorber" synthetic chamois cloths and kept on drying as we went along (after rinsing). I figured the water at the car wash might also be "hard" water, so I didn't want it to dry on the boat at all.

Once everything was clean and dry, the boat got two coats of Collinite #885 paste wax (three on the dark blue areas). Tomorrow I'll wash the windows inside and out.

Ahh, feels so good to have a sparkling clean, shiny boat again. And here I've been maligning salt water - man, "hard" fresh water is nothing to be sneezed at!

Sunbeam

PS: The one thing I wasn't able to really get "clean" was the lower parts of the engines - especially the Yamaha, but somewhat on the Honda too. Not sure what to try next or if it's even possible, but if I have success I will report back (or if anyone has any further ideas.... I'm all ears.)
 
Hi Sunbeam my first time at Powell I did like you just went to a rv wash and scrubbed. Looked fine
Drove away and parked, Boat now dry looked like I hadn't washed it! Went to Casey's in Arizona and stayed a bit, he told me about CLR which I used diluted and it did fine. For some reason this spring's visit to Powell I had no deposit issue. Water different due to low level or my hull speed traveling? I traveled slowly second visit. George. There's the key to lake Powell!
 
ghone":1zik8q02 said:
Hi Sunbeam my first time at Powell I did like you just went to a rv wash and scrubbed. Looked fine
Drove away and parked, Boat now dry looked like I hadn't washed it!
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I had a feeling the water at the car wash wasn't exactly "soft." Plus, yeah, just soap and water.... we tested that on a small patch and then dried with the Absorber to see....the deposits just laughed at that, so we moved on to bigger guns (and never let the car wash water dry on the boat).

ghone":1zik8q02 said:
Went to Casey's in Arizona and stayed a bit, he told me about CLR which I used diluted and it did fine.
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I think that may have sulfamic acid like Lime-Away does. I didn't look at the MSDS (because I found Lime-Away locally), but the two of them were mentioned together fairly often. Glad to hear that works as well - more options.

ghone":1zik8q02 said:
For some reason this spring's visit to Powell I had no deposit issue. Water different due to low level or my hull speed traveling?
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Interesting. Guess that means I should come back in the spring? :D (Level is still low now, so that alone doesn't account for it - but maybe a higher percentage of rain water or something?)
 
Part of the deposit is likely dead algae, aka pond scum, which is not always green. Here, at times it looks like an oil or fuel slick, but without any rainbow effects ... and can be difficult to remove, once dry. Algae growth varies with temperature, sunlight, and nutrients, the latter two hardly ever in short supply at Lake Powell, I suspect. I bet the combo of carbonates and dead algae is nearly structural. Glad it came off. Over time, the carbonates will get more and more crystalline, harder, grittier, eventually demanding muriatic acid aka hydrochloric acid. Using a 1:1 dilution of conc. Hydrochloric acid, you can dissolve marble and other carbonates modified by heat and pressure. Long as you don't iron the stuff onto the hull, household products will suffice. :wink:

Here, the household products used to clean fiberglass shower stalls and bathtubs have sulfamic acid listed right on the front of the spray bottles sold at the supermarket. Probably 4 or 5 to choose from at Fred Meyers, aka Krogers.
 
Hi Dave, and thanks again for the tip on the sulfamic acid.

I did have a "rusty" colored scum all over the bottom of the boat when I hauled, but that wiped off just with a damp rag no problem. Of course, it had never dried (was underwater), and I made sure to get it all off immediately upon hauling (figured it could be a nightmare otherwise). Interestingly it was no thicker (and maybe even less) near the waterline (as opposed to what I'm used to, which is the most "whatever" near the waterline and less on the actual underneath bottom).

The deposits on the rest of the boat were white, and of course were more "stuck on" because they had dried out every day. From what I now understand, the water evaporates and leaves the deposits. Since they did come off, I'm not sure I'd do anything differently next time, but one could probably avoid some of them by wiping down the boat in the evening.

Every time I walk by the boat now I get a smile. Shiny! Clean! Smooth! After reading online about the travails of getting hard water deposits off (mostly in bathrooms), I was getting nervous that they would be "permanent." So relieved it wasn't that bad. And I won't have to scratch Powell off my future list :D (Not that I really would have.)
 
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