It's not a C-dory nor a Tug but the family tree is there. At any rate I was walking by the offices for Bellingham Yacht sales and noticed that they are a dealer for Cutwater boats. They have a 26' Cutwater arriving 28 August so if anyone wants to take a look it will be there. I may take a look but at 160k it will be from afar!!!
Cutwater in Bellingham
- Thread starter c-ness
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thealaskan
New member
Gorgeous boat, especially the 28 (not sure why a 26?) and I suspect will be a big hit.
I predict it's own thread herein sooner or later.
I predict it's own thread herein sooner or later.
Beautiful boat? -- yes, but look at the cost. Fluid Marine makes boats with visually impressive interiors and creature comforts that are especially appealing to women. My wife loved the larger Ranger Tugs, and she loves the Cutwater, too. However, has anyone taken notice of the price of the Cutwater 26 after taking into account the cost for electronics, many optional creature comforts, shipping and sales tax? The cost could exceed $180,000. Ouch, and that's for a 26 foot boat! When my wife and I were looking into boat options last year, we found several boats of similar features, but it was always the same thing: these cost $150,000 or more when done. In my opinion, that's why boats like the C-Dory 22, and our new boat, the Marinaut 215 have gotten notice. Where else can you acquire solidly built boats, with excellent fuel economy, and with a spacious and functional living space for under $100,000?
I don't have an insider's track on sales figures, but my assumption is most cabin-type boat purchases are made by a couple. Designing an interior that has eye-appeal and nice esthetics is smart. Marketing such a boat to couples who can afford it is equally smart. How often do you think this phrase is said, "Oh, Honey, just take a couple hundred thousand dollars out of our account and get whatever boat you want. I'm sure I'll like it just fine." ??? 
Price per running foot isn't how most of us buy a boat. The "Wow Factor" when you step into a boat IS important. How functional the boat can be is important. But what has to happen before anyone will part with their money is: can you picture yourself on this boat, enjoying yourself? Ranger Tugs has done an outstanding job of understanding, marketing to, and catering to their customers.
Visit the TugNuts forum right now and you will see a thread on "Why we buy Ranger Tugs." Not a single response has mentioned the cost, but all have stated the outstanding factory and dealer support... and the lifestyle. There is a reason Ranger/Cutwater is selling boats.
There is a coaster under my drink right now... one of a "coastal series" of coasters; it says: "Boats are the nearest things to DREAMS that hands have ever made." (Yes, "dreams" is the largest word on the coaster) There are work boats and there are dream boats... and different marketing for either. If you want to sell boats to couples, it needs to appeal to both people.
An important rule in business is: know your customer. Not everyone can afford a C-Dory. Or a Ranger Tug. Or a Cutwater. Or a Nordhaven. But, each of those boats does have a market.
There was a recent thread here regarding images of a boat where the owner had done some nice wood enhancements in the boat; very well received. If I were wanting to sell boats, I'd take notice of that.
There is more to selling "a dream" than the cost. It's more about the value.
Best wishes,
Jim B.
Price per running foot isn't how most of us buy a boat. The "Wow Factor" when you step into a boat IS important. How functional the boat can be is important. But what has to happen before anyone will part with their money is: can you picture yourself on this boat, enjoying yourself? Ranger Tugs has done an outstanding job of understanding, marketing to, and catering to their customers.
Visit the TugNuts forum right now and you will see a thread on "Why we buy Ranger Tugs." Not a single response has mentioned the cost, but all have stated the outstanding factory and dealer support... and the lifestyle. There is a reason Ranger/Cutwater is selling boats.
There is a coaster under my drink right now... one of a "coastal series" of coasters; it says: "Boats are the nearest things to DREAMS that hands have ever made." (Yes, "dreams" is the largest word on the coaster) There are work boats and there are dream boats... and different marketing for either. If you want to sell boats to couples, it needs to appeal to both people.
An important rule in business is: know your customer. Not everyone can afford a C-Dory. Or a Ranger Tug. Or a Cutwater. Or a Nordhaven. But, each of those boats does have a market.
There was a recent thread here regarding images of a boat where the owner had done some nice wood enhancements in the boat; very well received. If I were wanting to sell boats, I'd take notice of that.
There is more to selling "a dream" than the cost. It's more about the value.
Best wishes,
Jim B.
Jim:
Purchase decisions should be made based on function as well as form. When you look at Ranger Tugs on the surface, they are more beautiful than its competition with respect to its interiors. They certainly nailed it with respect to form, but what about content, and why are they so much less expensive than Nordic Tugs, for example? I don't know the answer to this question. Perhaps Ranger Tugs have done a better job at catering to the needs of their customers, and have struck a balance between form and function, while providing significant value for its owners? Who am I to judge whether or not $180,000 is too much money for a 26 foot boat. That's like saying that a person who spends $400,000 on a Lamborghini is not getting a good value.
Everyone's needs are different. The very first boat we looked at last year was a Ranger Tugs 19. We initially fell in love with the idea of this boat on the Ranger Tugs website, so we went down to check one out at the dealer. It was absolutely beautiful to look at inside, but when we tried to walk through the cabin, I literally had to squeeze myself past the pilot's chair to get through -- it was that tight for me. It became clear that this was not the boat for my wife and I. To us, this was a boat with a lot of glitz, but we felt more cramped for space in the R19 than on our CD 16 Cruiser. We therefore felt that is was not a good value for us at $60,000. However, there are many people out there who love their Nordic Tug 19's. That's probably because they are a lot thinner than I, and for them, they find the cabin to be adequately spacious. To them, the R19 is a good value at the price offered.
So I stand corrected: let the buyer determine what is best for them with respect to form, function and value. If Ranger Tugs or Cutwater or Nordhaven meets their buyer's needs, then my hat is off to these manufacturers for hitting the mark in a very difficult environment for selling power boats, and I am happy for those who have fulfilled their dreams.
Rich
[/b]
Purchase decisions should be made based on function as well as form. When you look at Ranger Tugs on the surface, they are more beautiful than its competition with respect to its interiors. They certainly nailed it with respect to form, but what about content, and why are they so much less expensive than Nordic Tugs, for example? I don't know the answer to this question. Perhaps Ranger Tugs have done a better job at catering to the needs of their customers, and have struck a balance between form and function, while providing significant value for its owners? Who am I to judge whether or not $180,000 is too much money for a 26 foot boat. That's like saying that a person who spends $400,000 on a Lamborghini is not getting a good value.
Everyone's needs are different. The very first boat we looked at last year was a Ranger Tugs 19. We initially fell in love with the idea of this boat on the Ranger Tugs website, so we went down to check one out at the dealer. It was absolutely beautiful to look at inside, but when we tried to walk through the cabin, I literally had to squeeze myself past the pilot's chair to get through -- it was that tight for me. It became clear that this was not the boat for my wife and I. To us, this was a boat with a lot of glitz, but we felt more cramped for space in the R19 than on our CD 16 Cruiser. We therefore felt that is was not a good value for us at $60,000. However, there are many people out there who love their Nordic Tug 19's. That's probably because they are a lot thinner than I, and for them, they find the cabin to be adequately spacious. To them, the R19 is a good value at the price offered.
So I stand corrected: let the buyer determine what is best for them with respect to form, function and value. If Ranger Tugs or Cutwater or Nordhaven meets their buyer's needs, then my hat is off to these manufacturers for hitting the mark in a very difficult environment for selling power boats, and I am happy for those who have fulfilled their dreams.
Rich
[/b]
Hey Rich,
My apologies if I came across in a way that you felt a correction was necessary. You have a beautiful boat; you did plenty of research, but eventually had to take a leap of faith and it has paid off for you. Regardless of the price you paid (let's call it 60,000 bananas), there will be people who will say, "You paid 60,000 bananas for a boat??" And you will chuckle to yourself, because you know you received good value for your boat purchase.
I also know that there are people who have looked in our boat and said, "You spend months at a time in this?" If I told them they could have the boat for a hundred bucks they wouldn't take it. And plenty who have flat bottom bay fishing boats that ask, "What's a boat like that sell for?" And then nearly wet themselves when you tell 'em. Oh, and let's not forget the big boat owners who look at our boat and politely say, "Well, that's one way to do it."
I'm a fan of boats that are purposeful... and manufacturers who know who their customers are and know how to make and market boats to those people. And after a career in a discretionary income service business, there are people at all economic levels, including those who can write a check for anything. It's smart business to help get those folks what they want.
Since you mentioned Nordic Tug, the 26 was the boat that gave them their start (I'm not familiar with a Ranger or a Nordic 19) - they sold a bunch of 'em. Then started building bigger and bigger boats, forgetting their roots. Ranger Tugs stepped into that niche and has done very well with it. And while they are building bigger boats, they also still offer the 21 and keep making changes and upgrades to their 25 (the boat that really started their successful marketing). They will be introducing their new 31 at the Seattle Boat Show. While Les and Dave have shown us a new model, it's been a while since anyone has seen a "new model" C-Dory. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, just pointing out some major differences in marketing. There have been quite a few C-Dory owners who have purchased Ranger Tugs... I'm not aware of any who have moved the other way. The Rangers and Cutwaters seem to be giving folks a product that makes them want to part with their money.
Lots of neat boats out there!
Best wishes,
Jim B.
My apologies if I came across in a way that you felt a correction was necessary. You have a beautiful boat; you did plenty of research, but eventually had to take a leap of faith and it has paid off for you. Regardless of the price you paid (let's call it 60,000 bananas), there will be people who will say, "You paid 60,000 bananas for a boat??" And you will chuckle to yourself, because you know you received good value for your boat purchase.
I also know that there are people who have looked in our boat and said, "You spend months at a time in this?" If I told them they could have the boat for a hundred bucks they wouldn't take it. And plenty who have flat bottom bay fishing boats that ask, "What's a boat like that sell for?" And then nearly wet themselves when you tell 'em. Oh, and let's not forget the big boat owners who look at our boat and politely say, "Well, that's one way to do it."
I'm a fan of boats that are purposeful... and manufacturers who know who their customers are and know how to make and market boats to those people. And after a career in a discretionary income service business, there are people at all economic levels, including those who can write a check for anything. It's smart business to help get those folks what they want.
Since you mentioned Nordic Tug, the 26 was the boat that gave them their start (I'm not familiar with a Ranger or a Nordic 19) - they sold a bunch of 'em. Then started building bigger and bigger boats, forgetting their roots. Ranger Tugs stepped into that niche and has done very well with it. And while they are building bigger boats, they also still offer the 21 and keep making changes and upgrades to their 25 (the boat that really started their successful marketing). They will be introducing their new 31 at the Seattle Boat Show. While Les and Dave have shown us a new model, it's been a while since anyone has seen a "new model" C-Dory. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, just pointing out some major differences in marketing. There have been quite a few C-Dory owners who have purchased Ranger Tugs... I'm not aware of any who have moved the other way. The Rangers and Cutwaters seem to be giving folks a product that makes them want to part with their money.
Lots of neat boats out there!
Best wishes,
Jim B.
journey on
New member
Indeed, the ranger and Cutwater boats are very nice. However, the more I see of those boats, the more I'm impressed with our C-25, Journey On. At half the price of a Cutwater we're on the water and cruising and have been for 5 years.
I like boats that are well built and minimal, since I can afford them. When we went cruising to the South Pacific, we looked a a whole slew of boats, including cats. The bottom line was did we want a "nice" boat or did we want to go sailing? We picked a Catalina, built like a truck, and went sailing. Never regretted that decision and that thought process lead to us buying a C-Dory
I understand that not everyone agrees with us and that's OK. However, we're still cruising.
Boris
I like boats that are well built and minimal, since I can afford them. When we went cruising to the South Pacific, we looked a a whole slew of boats, including cats. The bottom line was did we want a "nice" boat or did we want to go sailing? We picked a Catalina, built like a truck, and went sailing. Never regretted that decision and that thought process lead to us buying a C-Dory
I understand that not everyone agrees with us and that's OK. However, we're still cruising.
Boris
No apologies are needed, Jim. Your opinions are highly valued on the C-Brats site, which is why I owed it to you and perspective Cutwater owners to clarify my position. Further, I misstated that the boat my wife and I toured was a Ranger Tug 19 (I must be C-Nile.) It was the Ranger Tug R-21ec! In order for the R-21ec to work for my wife and I, it needs to be wider and longer, which is a complex thing to do, because the manufacturer's goal was to produce a highly efficient displacement hull. If they increase the weight and beam, they would encounter decreased efficiency, and as a consequence, would need appreciably more horsepower. On the other hand, the boat is just fine for more fit people than I, who who are probably thrilled to own the boat for its high fuel efficiency.
Boris Et Al:
The C-Dory 22 and 25 are indeed beautiful boats. When my wife and I were in Friday Harbor, we saw a beautiful CD 22 Cruiser come in to the harbor -- it was C-Gnome! There were bigger boats in the harbor, but bigger does not mean better. She was beautiful to look at, and best of all, my wife and I met her owners Gerry & Cindy Walsh. We also met Charlie and Mellee at Friday Harbor. These two couplea were so friendly, hospitable and helpful that it made our trip very pleasurable, and I think that this is what is particularly special about the C-Brats website.
Thanks,
Rich
Boris Et Al:
The C-Dory 22 and 25 are indeed beautiful boats. When my wife and I were in Friday Harbor, we saw a beautiful CD 22 Cruiser come in to the harbor -- it was C-Gnome! There were bigger boats in the harbor, but bigger does not mean better. She was beautiful to look at, and best of all, my wife and I met her owners Gerry & Cindy Walsh. We also met Charlie and Mellee at Friday Harbor. These two couplea were so friendly, hospitable and helpful that it made our trip very pleasurable, and I think that this is what is particularly special about the C-Brats website.
Thanks,
Rich
All very nice boats. Very good comments about the boats and individual selection process. I have been seriously shopping for either a C-dory, Osprey, Parker, or Ranger for months now and can not convince my wife that she would be happy cruising on any of them. She is convinced they are all too small for extended cruising.
I think you have to define what you mean by extended cruising -- one week, two weeks, one month...? Where are you going to use the boat -- in the bay, intercoastal waterway, the Atlantic Ocean? How big a boat does she need to feel comfortable? What kind of creature comforts does she want? Have you and your wife taken an inside tour of these boats in person? How much are you willing to spend? These are only some of the questions that need answers.
Even after we bought the Marinaut, my wife Betty did not think she would enjoy spending more than 4 nights on a boat, and she ended up spending 19 straight nights. She loved it., which surprised me greatly. On the other hand, she does not want to stay on any boat more than 24 hours without getting off. So having a fast boat that gives us approximately 5 miles per gallon makes it possible for us to travel large distances economically while meeting her expectations. The thing that really changed her mind about cruising is staying in transient berths at good marinas: La Conner, Friday Harbor, and Cap Sante. She loved getting off the boat, traveling through the small maritime communities, walking, and eating out. We spent most of our time at the Cap Sante Boat Haven in Anacortes, WA. When one has access to facilities like that, one does not need to have a washer and drier on one's boat. Why cook, although on occasion we did? What a clean, well-run and well designed facility it is; indeed, what a wonderful town Anacortes is. So for us, extended cruising is moving around on the water from 2 to 5 hours before arriving at transient berths in marinas. Spending several days at a time on our boat without getting off would make us both go crazy, and I'm not sure we would be happy with even a 50 foot boat under those circumstances.
Rich
Even after we bought the Marinaut, my wife Betty did not think she would enjoy spending more than 4 nights on a boat, and she ended up spending 19 straight nights. She loved it., which surprised me greatly. On the other hand, she does not want to stay on any boat more than 24 hours without getting off. So having a fast boat that gives us approximately 5 miles per gallon makes it possible for us to travel large distances economically while meeting her expectations. The thing that really changed her mind about cruising is staying in transient berths at good marinas: La Conner, Friday Harbor, and Cap Sante. She loved getting off the boat, traveling through the small maritime communities, walking, and eating out. We spent most of our time at the Cap Sante Boat Haven in Anacortes, WA. When one has access to facilities like that, one does not need to have a washer and drier on one's boat. Why cook, although on occasion we did? What a clean, well-run and well designed facility it is; indeed, what a wonderful town Anacortes is. So for us, extended cruising is moving around on the water from 2 to 5 hours before arriving at transient berths in marinas. Spending several days at a time on our boat without getting off would make us both go crazy, and I'm not sure we would be happy with even a 50 foot boat under those circumstances.
Rich
retnavy":20wbbbra said:
If you have to "convince" her, perhaps it's time to re-think. Small boat cruising isn't for everyone. Have you two ever done any camping? RVing? If she has nothing to compare, bring her to a C-Brat gathering, where she can meet plenty of other wives who are happily cruising. For some folks, it's less about the size of the boat and more about the unknown of daily life while cruising... and if you tell her about it, it's not the same as if she hears it from someone (especially female) who has been out there.
While you might think differently with things I've said about other boats in this thread, we both really enjoy our C-Dory 25. Check out our cruising thread (let her read it) - http://www.c-brats.com/viewtopic.php?t=5212&start=0
If she doesn't like to read the forum, you can always get her a book about a couple and their cat who retire and take off cruising. :wink:
It's not unusual to have concerns about the unknown, especially when a big investment like a boat is involved. What if we don't like it? What if I don't like it? How do we not get hopelessly lost at sea? What if the weather is bad? How can we go out for lunch if we're on a boat? How do we get our mail? Where am I going to go to the bathroom... and where does it go? What if I get sea-sick? What if I miss my friends? How will I ever find another hairdresser? Can you really cook on one of those little boats? I saw Gilligan's Island - where did Ginger come up with all those clothes?
And every one of those questions is valid. Things are different on a small boat... but it's a difference that many of us here find refreshing. A new way to look at things; our own small floating cabin; a magic carpet to take you to interesting places, away from the crowds; a pace that you determine.
This past year, I asked Joan how she felt about looking at a bigger boat... "Look all you want, but Wild Blue is just plain easy and I like it!"
The only "convincing" I had to do when we went to the boat show in 2006 to look at C-Dorys was picking which model... I was thinking price and was pushing for the 22. She saw the extra room, storage space, fridge, hot & cold pressure water, and more on the 25, and said, "That one." So much for convincing. :wink:
If you aren't both on-board... well, you know.
Best wishes,
Jim B.
Pat Anderson
New member
We always are sorely tempted when we look at Rangers and Cutwaters at the SBS, but it passes, thank goodness! We realize Daydream is perfect for our kind of cruising and another big outlay would really be a waste of Anderson family resources!
Levitation
New member
I set out in 2010 - after reading this forum for some years - to buy a new or nearly new C-Dory in preparation for retiring someday (someday came suddenly and without an appointment shortly after that)... The factory was out of business so new boats were not available and the closest to new were expensive on a relative basis - as I remember the newest CD-25 hull available at that time was asking 85K - and there was no factory support (repetition is the key to clarity)...
I found a used R-25 with a hundred hours on it and it was well equipped, from AC to a Garmin 4212, for a bit more... On a bang for the buck basis it was the better buy - assuming that one has the extra dollars to spend... Fortunately we did... And there is factory support - hoo boy, is there...
So, but for a minor issue like the factory going belly up I would have been a C-Dory owner... I am content with how things worked out... I have not checked, but what is the price of a new CD-25 with all the options, big engine or twin motors (you are much faster than I, durn it), the 12" Garmin MFD, autopilot, radar, electric stove and AC/heat, generator, and a trailer? My suspicions is that it is close to a comparable R-25...
Me being a thriffffty lad, almost never buys new... (my wife says thrifty is pronounced 'tite') So, it is all relative... If the budget is 30K a used C-dory is in your future... If you can swing a bit more then one of the used Ranger's may beckon to you...
As far as new, I have not been on a new C-Dory yet, but I have been on the new Cutwaters and Rangers... Between the last two I still prefer the Ranger...
I found a used R-25 with a hundred hours on it and it was well equipped, from AC to a Garmin 4212, for a bit more... On a bang for the buck basis it was the better buy - assuming that one has the extra dollars to spend... Fortunately we did... And there is factory support - hoo boy, is there...
So, but for a minor issue like the factory going belly up I would have been a C-Dory owner... I am content with how things worked out... I have not checked, but what is the price of a new CD-25 with all the options, big engine or twin motors (you are much faster than I, durn it), the 12" Garmin MFD, autopilot, radar, electric stove and AC/heat, generator, and a trailer? My suspicions is that it is close to a comparable R-25...
Me being a thriffffty lad, almost never buys new... (my wife says thrifty is pronounced 'tite') So, it is all relative... If the budget is 30K a used C-dory is in your future... If you can swing a bit more then one of the used Ranger's may beckon to you...
As far as new, I have not been on a new C-Dory yet, but I have been on the new Cutwaters and Rangers... Between the last two I still prefer the Ranger...
retnavy":bt4s18n9 said:
A boat salesman's dream customer! Not only does he get the commission on the original sale (with no budget issue!), but he will likely get the commission on the resale in a couple months (so you can go back home). :twisted:
So, just for conversation sake, what kind of "bling" does your wife want? The Rangers and Cutwaters are certainly more elegant inside and hold their own in terms of fit and finish with any bigger boat. The C-Dorys are more spartan inside and don't come with built-in amenities like a microwave or a wine cooler. But, they are customizable... not a blank canvas, but plenty of room to work. And any of your choices are seaworthy for typical use.
We're here to help you, retnavy; tell us what might convince her... there is probably someone on here who has added it to their boat.
Best wishes,
Jim B.