New England Thanksgiving

F

ffheap

New member
Hi Folks,

Thanksgiving has always been a traditional New England event. I always looked forward to the times with family and to celebrate the first Thanksgiving that took place in Plymouth Massachusetts. I grew up with the story about the great Pilgrims and how they treated the Indians and shared their Harvest with them.. I have seen the great rock the Pilgrims landed on in 1620. (It really isn't a great rock, and there is much questioning that the Pilgrims landed on the Rock.)

Then along came MAYFLOWER, a great book by a great Nantucket author, Nathaniel Philbrook. I read the book and this week saw the movie version on The History Channel, which followed the book very closely.

My problem is I have been hood winked all these years that the Pilgrims were great people. Yes, there is no question that the Journey they took, coming to New England, was great. The problem is what happened after they arrived, not just when they arrived.

The Pilgrims were nothing but a group of selfish people who killed off the Indians, including their friends, so they could get their lands. Miles Standish, the guy written up in the John Greenleaf Whitter Poem, was the worst of them all. He was nothing but a murderer. John Winslow, who built a home in Marshfield Massachusetts, the town I grew up in, was not much better. His son Josiah was not much better.

What Philbrick did was to research the truth, and tell is as it was.( His book on the ESSEX was very disturbing to the Nantucketers because he revealed that cannibalism took place by their ancestors.)

Happy Thanksgiving, and don't eat to much.

Fred
 
Fred-

Thanks for the reality lesson! :smileo

Now you've gone and busted the convenient and contrived myths! :cry

Someday you'll have to recount the real stories behind the Salem Witchdraft Trials! :xseek

Happy Thanksgiving! :wink

Joe.
 
ffheap":1knpwr9x said:
he revealed that cannibalism took place by their ancestors.)
Happy Thanksgiving, and don't eat to much.
Fred
Click to expand...

Thanks Fred.......you certainly increased my appetite! :roll:

(P. S. Happy Thanksgiving!)
 
A friend calls Halloween the "heathen holiday." I've been meaning to
mention thanksgiving as the "intolerate religious fanatics holiday." Apparently
I can add "murdering", too. Cool!

Mike
 
Haven't read this book yet, though probably will. Rarely does a book of this type not have an agenda or an unbiased view. On any subject like this it pays to check out the author, the research, and other books on the subject before forming a locked in opinion or changing a former one. Have also been at the landing site and toured the replica Mayflower. Will enjoy this Thanksgiving Day and be appreciative for everything we have.

I've read many books on Custer, some much better researched than others. From these you would have good evidence to support Him being one of the best or worst military men this country has produced.

Two of my Sons are Arkeologist and we have some lively discussions.

Jay
 
Well, fun. Joan and one of her sisters are gathering at her Mother's place for Thanksgiving... we'll try to enjoy each others' company, have some lively conversation, and (of course) good eats. I'm pretty sure there is no murder, mayhem, nor cannibalism planned for the holiday. We'll see how it goes. :wink:

In the spirit of sharing, we came across an internet friend (from a sailing site) yesterday as we pulled into West Marine. A total chance meeting, but I recognized the boat. We altered our plan a bit, and I went with him to the waterfront while Joan drove across town to pick up her Mother. My friend had not been to this area before and has never sailed in salt water... it was fun to visit with him and be able to share a little local knowledge (even though we aren't in our local area) and help him get into a slip.

And no cannibalism. We have much to be thankful for.

Happy Holidays,
Jim B.
 
And when it looks like this, it's cooked! :shock:

Or is that "Cookin'" :?:

Turkey.jpg


Happy Thanksgiving to all.
:thup :thup
Charlie
 
Catman said:
Can anyone reasonably dispute we've been fed a load of bullshit about how we came to be? That is, along with the truth.

Catman,

No. But then again show me the history of the country that hasn't. It would seem that most people, clans, tribes and countries like to improve after the fact there origins.

What wears on me is the excessive condemnation of our own countries origins, while giving a free ride to the rest of the world and the peoples here before the pilgrims. We, especially those coming from Europe judge ourselves to be the most bloody unethical people in the history of the world, while the noble savage and the rest of mankind is let off pretty lite. It would seem to me the past and present of most people unrestrained is bloody and excuses readily made for abhorrent behavior. Most of the tribes or nations here before the Europeans each considered themselves to be the only REAL PEOPLE. Thereby justifying there actions toward the nations or tribes around them. The real estate of the world has been a continuous succession of bloody unethical conquest since the event of mankind. Ours, while not good certainly does not compare to most others in the past. We are a most self condemning people.

Imagine if you can being one of those small group of Pilgrims in 1620 leaving a bloody Europe and trying to survive here with no backup and surrounded by an alien to them culture, that was very unhappy with there presence. We have a tendency to look at the past from the safety and comfort of the present.

Jay
Click to expand...
 
Hey guys , it is Thanksgiving and if you spend all your time looking back you might miss it. Like Tyboo , I believe Santa will be headed your way soon so look forward and be thankful for what you have. Whether or not our past was perfect or not is of no consequence. We should learn from it and move on. Mike on Huda Thunkit
 
Catman":11w6n2qi said:
Can anyone reasonably dispute we've been fed a load of bullshit about how we came to be?
Click to expand...

Somebody's just grouchy because they didn't get their favorite Thanksgiving picture on the front page.

Here you go, good buddy.




fpt.jpg
 
Hi Folks,

Sorry to disturb anybody, but Philbrook is a great historian. He was the one who wrote the book on the Essex. He is not a BS,er.

I only wanted to present another view about the Pilgrims. Every year, on the Thanksgiving Day Parade in Plymouth, they have to call out extra Cops, because the Indians arrive and tell their side of the story, and the others don't like it. As one Indian said, "If the people don't like the truth, that is their problem."

Philbrook's interest is the truth. He did not just tell a story, he documented every thing from original sources and letters. He did not set out to disturb anybody, he set out to tell the historical truth about the Pilgrims. As I said, I was disturbed because everything I was led to believe was disputed by Philbrook. It bothered me, and everybody else who I know read the book.

As for Santa Claus, "yes Virginia, there is a Santa Claus."

Fred
 
Fred, good post. I agree. FYI, from a former resident:

Commonwealth of Massachusetts Motto: "Our Taxes Are Lower Than Sweden's"

Commonwealth of Virginia Motto: "Who Says Government Stiffs & Slackjaw Yokels Don't Mix?"

Charlie (recently a Virginia Resident, now a Maine Resident)
 
Well truth seekers, Maybe we are hard on "our own" simply because it is ours and that is really what we should concern ourselves with. My daughter who is a librarian pointed out to me that it's all up there under the heading "mythology." Dewey, of the decimal system Dewey, was a wise man. For that, along with Santa and all the other good things, I give thanks.
 
Fred,

Nathaniel Philbrick has an article in the new Dec 06 issue of Cruising World Magazine about his first offshore adventure from Portugal to Madeira. I haven't read his books, but I like the way he writes. Good article.

Dun (CTYankee)
 
Yesterday, Jo-Lee was sitting on the couch reading a book. I noticed there was a big Mayflower on the cover. She had picked it up from the library thinking it would be a good read. I hadn't mentioned to her there had been some discussion about it and Thanksgiving here. Plan on reading it after her. I hope, I too like the way Philbrick writes.

Prefer the truth. Can deal with the cold hard facts. Sometimes have to do a little discerning before I reach a conclusion on just what they are.

Accurate well researched stories about real people doing extraordinary things is my preferred reading. Among these are a good many who have made it possible for us to be in the peace and comfort we are this Holiday.

Jay
 
Once, long ago, I lived in a tent on an island in the west indies. It was San Salvador island. There were (are) two little towns on the island, Cockburn town and United Estates. On one corner of the island, where nobody ever goes, there is a simple white cross, maybe 10 feet tall. At it's base is a plaque which says something like "On or near this spot, in the year 1492 Christopher Columbus discovered the New World". In the perhaps 50 years since I lived there (courtesy of the US Navy), the 'important ' parts of this story have been, in some quarters, discredited. Even then we would joke that the town was called United Estates beauause Columbus had an Italian accent. I don't really know if that's where Columbus discovered a new world, but I know it's where I did.
 
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