Secondary Steering Station

G

Gene Stebbs.

New member
Has anyone installed an additional steering station outside at the rear of the pilothouse? Just the bare basics, steering, throttle, shifter. I have done this before, the first boat I used only had a hand tiller in the fishing cockpit. I added a small wheel, fathometer, throttle and shifter, made pulling fish a lot nicer when my father in law was taking a nap. I know this is by no means needed just a luxury item.
 
I had Bitter End Boatworks add a rear helm to my Great Republic. To me it was worth every penny. I fish alone quite often and love how much handier it makes it. It also makes pulling pots a lot easier!
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Gene-

There have been quite a few C-Dorys with secondary cockpit helms.

Hydraulic steering is much easier to add a second steering station to vs. cable/push-pull systems, as it becomes one big system with two control pumps, similar to how an auto-pilot works.

The expensive part is duplicating the throttle/shift controls. Both mechanical and fly-by-wire dual controls are very high priced.

For that reason, some have left the main engine controlled by the forward helm, and the kicker controlled by the cockpit helm, as far as throttle/shift controls.

Whether that is workable for you depends on your type of use for the combined system.

Dual or twin main motors will require a dual throttle/shift system.

There have been some interesting solutions to this adaptation, I'll let the folks that did them speak for themselves.

Good Luck!

Joe. :teeth :thup
 
I am considering adding the ability to control the boat from the cockpit by installing autopilot and using a remote control, or hardwired AP control.

It is true that the trickiest part is not the steering, but the controls. While you cannot engage forward/reverse with this unit, it controls engine RPM on a fine scale to facilitate trolling. Might be a good compromise for some:

http://www.cabelas.com/product/TrollMas ... 129&rid=20
 
I got the full-meal deal when I had the boat built (2006 23 CC Venture). There is a complete helm in the cockpit with Teleflex/Morse KE-4 engine controls and Teleflex SeaStar Hydraulic steering. The builder was eager to do one this way, so I got it basically at cost. It was still a pile of money, but I am so glad I did it. If you single hand the boat a lot, and find yourself in really windy and rough conditions, being able to control the boat from the cockpit can make getting to the dock safely a lot easier.

If you are contemplating a second helm, I would think carefully about placement of controls. I moved my shifter/throttle at the cockpit helm station after hitting it once with my foot and shifting the engines into forward while jumping to the dock. It was exciting for a moment or two, but all ended well.
 
While our boat does not have a cockpit steering station and I do not have any experience with these, I can tell you that for the purpose of fishing ( trolling ) I think it would be hard to beat using an auto pilot.
Our 22 cruiser has auto pilot and I tie our 8hp Honda to the 90 hp Honda and then use a troll master throttle control on the 8hp. we also have a remote control for the auto pilot that can be used in the cockpit to change course if needed, but rarely use it. This system is quite a luxury and I have to say I love it. the Auto pilot is also very nice for cruising in general. While a separate steering station would be nice, it would take up a lot of room in an already limited space cockpit and seems as though it would interfere with boarding the boat especially if you had a camper back. If you already have AP try this system first. It will also be less expensive. The trollmaster is very nice to have anyways as it makes for a very accurate and easy to obtain rpm control for the kicker motor. If you don't already have AP "Try it you'll like it"!

Doug
 
Thanks for the posts, I will be alone nearly all the time for 4 months so the secondary helm is somethng I consider a pretty good feature for my situation as planned at this point in time. I have a lot of time before getting a boat but want to use the time to try and be as prepared and have as many factors considered as possible before I choose a boat. I was pretty much sold on a Sea Sport until I found this sight and learned about the semi dory hull and its potential. I have no doubt now that a 25' cdory will be just what will work best for me. Thanks again to all...... but if I sink the first day out I will come back to haunt you..(VBG)
 
Gene -

I have a 25 Cruiser and it came from the factory with a rear steering station (no throttle controls). I didn't find it terribly useful without throttle controls. Maybe if I fished out in the ocean with more space between boats I'd find it more useful. With how crowded the Columbia / Willamette can get, I never felt comfortable being that far way from engine controls.

I spent quite a bit of time researching how best to add throttle controls to the rear station. I have the worst possible engine setup for doing this: twin Honda 90s with mechanical throttle/shit controls. Switching to electronic controls (ex. Teleflex KE series) was an option, but it would have been very difficult to find space for all of the components that make up that system (control modules, actuators for each engine, etc). It was also about $7-8k. I ended up going with Kobelt mechanical controls for about half that price. Both rear and main helm controls had to be replaced since it works in a master / slave setup.

I single-hand most of the time so having the throttle controls back there has made docking / undocking quite a bit easier. Visibility is the main issue with the rear helm station. When standing up, it's just about useless since the cabin top / radar arch / etc blocks most of the forward view. I've found that if I sit on the gunwale and open the door to the head (it blocks a large portion of the visibility to the port side), I have a very good all-around view. I still wouldn't use it for anything but displacement speeds.

One additional caveat I will throw in here is about the 2nd hydraulic steering station. I've had a persistent problem with air in the system, even after power-bleeding with the Teleflex professional bleeder numerous times. Both helm pumps are new so it's not an issue with any leaks / seals. I've had a few different shops look at it and they can't find anything wrong. One shop discussed it with Teleflex. The one Teleflex engineer told us that additional helm pumps were not designed to be at the same elevation. Having a 2nd helm pump on a fly bridge for example gives air the ability to rise and be bled properly. Having the 2nd helm pump at the same level makes it very difficult to get all the air out. I've never heard this before, but I'm starting to believe it.

If you ever want to check out a 25 with rear station, I'm not far from you.
 
I've been thinking about a second steering station for awhile too. I'm thinking about a small platform behind cabin on starboard side to stand on and see over the cabin (be a good seat /boarding step also). Probably only use it at at displacement speeds. It would mean raising the steering up at least halfway up the window but that' doable.
Here's a link to a DIY Second station. I have another one but can't seem to find it in my bookmarks. I'll keep looking-it may have been on "The Hull Truth" site.

http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-for ... -boat.html
 
I’m thinking of adding a second hydraulic wheel to my angler just below the window for use at moderate speeds in open water. I’m not up for the expense of engine controls just yet, but would install a kill switch. Am I nuts? Seems like looking over the cabin once in a while at 7 knots wouldn’t be a lot different than looking under my Genoa close hauled on my last sailboat.
I’ve only made the transition to power last year, but as much as I like the cabin it’s nice to get outside some days
 
I’m thinking of adding a second hydraulic wheel to my angler just below the window for use at moderate speeds in open water. I’m not up for the expense of engine controls just yet, but would install a kill switch. Am I nuts? Seems like looking over the cabin once in a while at 7 knots wouldn’t be a lot different than looking under my Genoa close hauled on my last sailboat.
I’ve only made the transition to power last year, but as much as I like the cabin it’s nice to get outside some days
 
You can see a rear helm on a Cape Cruiser 26 in my pics. Gene Sterner put the helm and steering controls on when he built the boat. Les Lampman set up the motors and throttle control. The main motor is controlled on the front helm only. The kicker is controlled from the rear helm only.
 
beermanPDX":1gmss20m said:
I've had a persistent problem with air in the system, even after power-bleeding with the Teleflex professional bleeder numerous times. ...The one Teleflex engineer told us that additional helm pumps were not designed to be at the same elevation. Having a 2nd helm pump on a fly bridge for example gives air the ability to rise and be bled properly. Having the 2nd helm pump at the same level makes it very difficult to get all the air out. I've never heard this before, but I'm starting to believe it.
Click to expand...
If that's the case it seems you could try bleeding the system by putting the boat on a trailer and parking on a steep incline.
 
Check my album “snoopy-c” I added a 2nd hem to both Snoopy -C and C-Miner. Had hydraulic steering with 2nd pump on each and full shift and throttle controls, as well as trollmaster electric throttle control on kickers on each. Worked great. Pictures show some of the plumbing under the stove area.
 
c-dog22":2avqg3k1 said:
I’m thinking of adding a second hydraulic wheel to my angler just below the window for use at moderate speeds in open water. I’m not up for the expense of engine controls just yet, but would install a kill switch. Am I nuts? Seems like looking over the cabin once in a while at 7 knots wouldn’t be a lot different than looking under my Genoa close hauled on my last sailboat.
I’ve only made the transition to power last year, but as much as I like the cabin it’s nice to get outside some days
Click to expand...

For your "Kill Switch" I would highly recommend taking a look at the Fell Marine MOB+ device. I'm gong on 4-5 years, with mine an I love it. Put it on like a watch when you get on the boat. Gives you freedom to roam on our boats, but is still immediately active in 3 ways.
1. Fall overboard and it will sense the water pressure from being submerged a few inches
2. Get too far away from the boat, (about 50 feet)
3. Manually tap the button on your wrist.
Any of the 3 will immediately cut the power and stop the engines. Can be rigged for single or dual engines.

Fell Marine link:
https://www.fellmarine.com

and the link to their MOB+
https://buy.fellmarine.com/collections/ ... k-multifob

Harvey
SleepyC:moon

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