22 Angler options

sawmilldon

New member
When I take the plunge for my first boat, it will no doubt be used. I am aware of a few things that are different on the older boats, the wood rails on top of the cabin in lieu of stainless for example.

Can anyone recap what changes have been made over the years? I am looking at the 87 Angler on the for sale post, and I wonder how the newer boats have changed.

If there is an existing thread to point me too, great. I did not see one.

Thanks for any help.
 
On the home page of the C-Brats there is a link for the C-Dory Factory. On their WEB Site is a list of factory options. I've got a 1988 16' Angler and it came without a bow rail, bilge pump, or any instrementation. :sad

My upper rails were wood which I had to replace. I replaced them with Teak of the same configureation rather than have to fill a bunch of holes. :smilep
 
sawmilldon-

I have an '87 Cruiser, and while it's somewhat different, I can start you out with a list of differences.

1. The roof rails will be teak, but can usually be refinished or replaced. They look (IMHO) better than stainless and are much larger in diameter, and therefore easier to hold on to.

2. The rear door, dinette top, and interior paneling will be 3/4" marine plywood surfaced with a plastic teak appearing wood grain that is usually refinishable too a new like appearance. This is called Decaguard. (Usually only the external surface of the door is bleached out by the sun, and it can be re-placed with a new skin or painted with a solid color to match the trim.)

3. The roof will be the lower type (about 6' 2' or so), not the high top option.

4. The front center window is fixed, and does not open.

5. Steering will be mechanical unless someone has replaced it with hydraulic steering.

6. All electronics will be whatever the owners have installed. The boat comes with navigation lights, manual windshield wipers (port and starboard, not on the center window) although electrics can be installed as an option.

7. The bow rail (pulpit) and anchor roller are standard, a windlass will be an option, as are the type of anchor and rode carried. The boat has a bulkhead making an anchor locker in the forpeak. A deck pipe is optional.

8. The number of batteries is optional, as is their placement and rigging.

9. The bilge pump(s) are usually added by the dealer, who with the original owner chooses the model and specific rigging. They may have been replaced once or twice by now.

10. The shorter cabin of the Angler has a single sided dinette to port and a shelf to starboard where the Cruiser has a galley. I don't know what factory equipment comes with The Angler on the shelf behind the helm seat. The Cruiser comes with a sink and an alcohol stove. There's an 18 gallon water tank under the rear dinette seat on the Cruiser.

11. All engine choices and rigging are made by previous owners and installed (usually) by dealers.

12. The v-berth has a openable privacy curtain (vinyl) covering the front dash/bulkhead opening, a Porta-Potti in the center well of the berth, and upholstered cushions covering the v-berth. These were originally soft
Sunbrella fabric (Not the hard canvas type used for enclosures). The fabric matches the helm and dinette cushions. Mine are 20 years old and in great shape!

13. Any cabin heater will be an option selected by a previous owner.

14. Bottom paint is not standard.

15. The trailer is supplied by the original or a subsequent dealer.

16. Floor coverings and any raised floor or rubberized mats in the cockpit are previous owner add-ons.

17. The port lazarette can be made into a live well. This could be done by the dealer or by a previous owner. Not standard.

18. Shore Power is an option, not standard. Might be factory installed or by a dealer or owner.

19. Limited interior lighting is standard, a cabin light at the rear over the door, and a light in the v-berth. Adding fluorescent lighting is a nice option.

20 Various cabin amenities such as magazine, chart, galley, and towel racks and many other possibilities will usually by owner installed after market items.

This may or may not be complete, but I'm sure it will get you started. Hope it helps!

Joe. :thup :teeth
 
Thanks for the help.

I think that a cruiser would be better for the family, but the choice may be a gametime decision. Whatever is available within our price range, you know?

We looked at a new TomCat, and my wife loved teh full head/shower.

The Portathingy may not be near enough to her comfort zone.

Are all of the full heads able to act as a shower? Is it an easy conversion if they do not?
 
sawmilldon-

I'll let someone more experienced with the shower issue answer that one, but here's some free advice.

If you really feel that the Cruiser would be a better fit for your family (and it very probably is!), have the courage and discipline to wait for the right one to come along.

We all get fever-pitched when buying a new boat, but waiting for the right one at the right price can be very much worthwhile, and it will avoid a lot of disappointment and remorse later!

That's as easy and as succinct as I can say it, and I'm not doing so to be a know it all, just some friendly advice from one who's been there!

Good Luck!

Joe. :thup :teeth
 
Sawmilldon,

Sea Wolf told you exactly correct. If you buy a boat that is "just ok" you will regret it all the while you own it. I recommend that you heed his advice because he is right on the mark.
 
sawmilldon-

Yes, any of the separate bathroom models (CD25, TC255) can be converted with full showers. Actually, most are standard with it. However, I wouldn't dwell on this too much, you'll need a hot water heater (110V required -- dock usually), power hookups, sump pump and discharge routing to a holding tank (usually), a door mod to keep the water inside the bathroom (on older models) and maybe a few other things. The complexity of the system, operation and weight are substantial to be able to just turn those knobs and have hot water spewing out! Many of us use a simpler solution, a Sun Shower. Either use it in the cockpit with a portable enclosure (or none if you're not shy :shock: ) or route it into the bathroom through the bath window (then again you'll need the door mod, sump pump, holding tank). You can have the sun heat it or on cold cloudy days, add some hot water from the stove.

Just some options to think about.
 
I certainly agree with Joe and Steve. Wait for the right boat--and travel if necessary to buy it. The Tom Cat has the shower which is most user friendly (for me)--the CD 25 does not have quite as much head room. But at the best, the "shower" in the head, has its limitations and is not like a separate stall shower. We still jump in the lake or ocean, use a salt water soap and shampoo and then shower off with hot water from a sun shower etc. In other places we may heat water and use it in the sun shower. The water heater is sort of a waste, but the boats come with it. I would much rather have a one gallon tank with a 800 watt heater, than the 6 to 10 gallon 1500 watt 110 volt heater, which can only be used with a large generator or at a dock.

Start looking now, and find the boat you want. You may want to look at the 25 as well as the Tom Cat. It has almost as much room and is much less expensive, plus is easier to trailer.
 
Sawmilldon-

I don't know what price range you're looking at, but being prepared to buy in a bit of a hurry is a good strategy, although it sounds like counter to my original advice.

You DO want to wait for the right boat. One which really fits your needs and is at a good price. Don't jump at the first boat that's just OK.

BUT when you DO find the RIGHT boat at the RIGHT price, you'll have to act quick to SNATCH it up before others do. This means having your finances ready to go, including enough cash to secure the deal, and arrangements to finance the rest, if necessary.

More than occasionally very good boats come up for sale at real bargain prices.

When I'm looking for a boat, I carry the cash for the down payment and I'm ready to write a check for the balance of the price, then go to a branch bank and either get cash to redeem the check or get a cashier's check, either way to close the deal. Saves time and hassle. Others may have to arrange financing once the down payment is accepted.

You may have to travel to get that RIGHT boat. Financing the final purchase may be a bit more complicated if you're not near home, and you may want to investigate the possibilities and potential problems with your bank beforehand.

The Boy Scouts don't have a badge in economics (to my knowledge), but BE PREPARED still applies!

Good Luck!

Joe. :rainbow :thup :teeth
 
Further to what Joe said, there is one guy here who bought a very nice boat sight unseen in MN -- he lived quite a ways away, but I disremember where. There is a thread here about that.
 
Much of this whole head/shower/porta-potty situation is perception. If SawmillDon's wife doesn't think she will be happy with a porta-potty, the only thing that will change her mind is actual use. Same with a shower. It doesn't look or act like your bathroom at home, and the uninitiated will think that may mean inconvenience, improper sanitation, or possible hardship. And if you want your significant other to participate in this activity, you have to eliminate that perception.

Not to be graphic, but this head question comes up frequently here and deserves to be addressed. From my perspective, it really comes down to usable, functional space... and we all have different requirements for that. For me, the difference between the various size boats is more about the space than the length. The 25s have room for a separate head, the others don't. Except for one case documented here (where the owner took out the dinette and put an enclosed head in his 22), if you are going to spend time aboard, you will find that you need: a place to drive the boat (helm), a place to cook (galley), a place to eat and sit (dinette), and a place to sleep (v-berth)... and with the smaller boats, you are now out of space, but you still need to deal with bathroom functions. Everyone has a different need for privacy, as well. Again, just my opinion, the enclosed head is a real convenience... we have had other boats with and without, so we've had the opportunity to see it both ways. If you have the room and the budget, an enclosed head is the way to go. We still use a solar shower as often as the water heater and pressure pump, but that's because we are frequently trying to conserve water.

Not many of us would be happy with a house that doesn't have a bathroom. When was the last time you stayed in a motel/hotel that didn't have a bathroom? Most people wouldn't consider an overnight in a place like that, but we can camp in a tent. Yep, perception.

It's that same perception that makes a boat with an interior liner and fuzzy fabrics on the walls more appealing to many at a boat show. "Look, Ma, it's got a built in coffee maker!" And a bathroom.

Spend some time onboard, and you will soon find what is important for your personal comfort level. In most homes, the bathroom is the smallest room in the house, but you still wouldn't do without it. Why is that different on a boat? "But, Jim," you're saying, "we don't have a head in our land vehicles." Ah, remember that "boaterhome" analogy that is often applied to the C-Dorys? I don't recall seeing a motorhome without a place to potty. :wink: But in our RVing, we've come across people who don't use the bathroom facilities in their RVs (???). Perception.

What all this verbage comes down to: you may need a head to convince the significant other that boating is something pleasant to participate in. Whether it's enclosed or a portable situation could be negotiable... maybe. :wink:

When we cruise, we want to be clean. It doesn't mean we will take a long hot shower like you do at home, but I like to wash my hair and shave every day. And I'm going to poop and pee. Daily. If you have guests onboard for more than a couple hours, they are likely going to need a potty, as well. It's something that needs to be addressed. Comfort zone.

So, Don, I'd recommend you bring your wife to a C-Brat gathering. Let her visit with others who spend lots of time onboard. Hear the excitement in their voices. See how they've set up their boats. I doubt you'll find any who are shy in sharing their experiences, including how they deal with the potty and shower situation. When you learn that it can be a fun adventure and not an ordeal, it's much easier to work together to select the right boat.

Good luck with the search.

Best wishes,
Jim B.
 
Well said, Jim. If I want Judy to cruise with me, we have a head. Period.

We used a portapotty under the v-berth in a 22 sailboat. Then we moved up to a 25 sailboat, with a separate head and we aren't going back. Especially as we get older. There's a single guy who has a bucket for his head in his 30' trawler. OK for him, but not for us.

I noticed there are several late model 22's for sale, but no 25's. The 22 is certainly easier to haul launch and run (and looks better.) Maybe the head makes a difference.

Boris
 
Sawmilldon:

Anglers have much larger back decks which I enjoy for fishing, crabbing, hunting, etc. but you do sacrifice cabin space. You should probably take a realistic look at your use for the boat and then sit down with your wife to see what works for you both. My wife and I have no problem with the porta-pottie and prefer it over the marine head we had in our sail boat and we also use the sun shower but we also primitive camp a lot so we are used to it.

Many people just use their boats for day trips and occasional overnights and you may find that the added expense and maintenance of a built in head and shower wont pencil out in actual use.

I would love a new 25 footer but could never afford something like that and we lucked into an older Angler with a new kicker, Zodiac, and all kinds of extra gear for 8K. I agree with the others that you should get what makes you happy and will be used the most by you and your wife but if your finances are limited you can still have a great boat and a heck of a good time in an older boat.

Good luck in your search and make sure you let us know what you end up with.

Andy
 
Great discussion, very reasonable. I may have to bring my wife to a C-Dory gathering to get some perspective. Maybe my 22 Angler choice may have to become a 24 TomCat or?? Or if she can be happy with an unenclosed portapotty (I really doubt it), the Angler can be a first step. May be a much bigger issue than my state of denial is realizing. Fortunately, still have a year or so to sort it out.

Plus, I don't want much of any galley, minimal, to no running water, so maybe building an enclosed head is the answer. Or maybe her love of the catamaran idea is the answer.
 
RJD Wannabe":3lqc7sve said:
Or maybe her love of the catamaran idea is the answer.

The main reason I have a Tom Cat (was considering several other pilothouse fishboats) is because my wife saw the Tom Cat and decided we didn't need to look any further. :mrgreen:
 
The main reason I have a Tom Cat (was considering several other pilothouse fishboats) is because my wife saw the Tom Cat and decided we didn't need to look any further.
_

We went to the San Diego boat show in November, same response by wife. She liked the TomCat way more than the 25 Cruiser, they didn't have a 22 Angler, the 22 Cruiser had too small of a cockpit. We'd really like to see a 24 TomCat and spend time with some owners. We'll have to make a get together sometime. Looking forward to it!!
 
If she hadn't done that (decided on the Tom Cat) I would never have become involved with the Brats to the extent that I have. With the benefit of 20/20 hindsight, I am very glad she made that decision!

Warren
 
Salmon Slayer hit it on the head when he said that daytrips and occasional overnights would be the usage pattern.

We live about a mile from 2 boat launches out here on an island, we love to fish, crab and whatnot. We are still working, so it will be a while before we can just go off and cruise.

We are considering a trip to the Portland Boat Show this week, I will be out of town for the one in Seattle. That will help us visualize.
 
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