90HP Honda VS 115 HP Suzuki

My one cent worth. If you are boating at or near sea level with a 22', the 115 hp of any brand is overkill. I used a Honda 90 for years with complete satisfaction. It was only when my boating was confined to high altitudes did I opt for the 115, that a Mercury EFI (Yamaha block). For reasons not clearly understood, Mercury motors aren't popular on the coastal areas.

IMO it is difficult to find an EFI from a reputable manufacturer that isn't first rate. My first Honda 90 (carb) fifteen years ago had a lower unit made by Mercury. Absolutely trouble free. I'll wager if the truth were known, all these motors contain components from all over the world. The designers of the CD 22' promoted the Honda 75, not the 90. But the boat owners found out the motors weighed the same so why not go for the extra ponies?

Yellowstone John
 
Joe,

Memory? gee. Because I owned 1/2 of a mercury dealership in 1942 I think I might have known that!

John, you are spot on! My early 22's ran great with the old 2-strokes. Light and stinky.

The reason I'm overboard on the Honda 115 is not it's hp. Smooth, quiet, very fuel efficient, and breathing easy at cruise. Makes me wish my present carb 90 would die!!

You young uns have a great Merry Christmas -- life is good and a house full of kids, grandkids, and a bunch of great-greats will keep me rocking with a big grin.

Dusty :wink:
 
One major reason that the Merc 10 hp (and a number of other motors which were 15 + hp) were labeled as 10 hp was that many lakes would not allow more than 10 HP (and many motors labeled as 9.9 or 9.8 hp.

I certainly agree with Yellowstone John, that any 90 is plenty of outboard for the C Dory 22 up until you get up into high elevations!
 
Honda’s B.L.A.S.T. technology, the motor was dyno tested at yielding 126 horsepower according to a Feb 2011 article by Leisure Boating (see below link.) The article went on to state its technological benefits, such as NMEA 2000 compliance, very quiet operation, and 19 percent greater efficiency (as stated by Honda) over previous models.
Click to expand...

Ok now we are getting somewhere. This is what I asked about in the beginning. If there where any advantages that justify the 115 over the 150. The one down side of my 225 is that I cant use, as far as I know, NMEA 2000 to connect to my chart plotter. Just a little before the times. Fi and better fuel burn would be nice too. Unfortunately the 225 is so well built it will be a while before I wear it out. wish I could say the same for the Fi90s. seems they have turned into a disappointment for heavy hour users. I dont think you will wear one out on a c-dory but the guides are dumping them because of longevity problems. Which is to bad because my carb 90 ran great. over a thousand hours in 5 years and never missed a beat. Lets hope the honda 115 does as good.
 
Tom Et. Al.,

The Honda BF115 is essentially an Accord engine. As Dusty stated, it breaths "...easy at cruise." So I'm not worried about engine longevity from a mechanical stand point. However, I do have one slight concern, and that's internal saltwater corrosion. According to what I've been told, corrosion is not an issue with the new models. Yet, Honda instructs its owners to flush the motor after each saltwater water use. And they make it incredibly easy to do so with their quick access fresh water flushing system. I intend to religiously flush my motor out after each use, because Long Island Sound has a higher saline concentration than the PNW. The reason for this is that our very shallow protected waters are subjected to many warm, sunny days, which increases the evaporation rate. A relative of mine has had a Honda BF150 for 5 years now, has flushed his engine with fresh water every time out, and thus far has sustained no corrosion issues.
As an aside, replacing the engine's sacrificial anodes on a regular schedule is also critical, and wonder if reports of past engine corrosion in a saltwater environment may actually result from failure to perform this maintenance.

Thanks!

Rich
 
The corrosion problems I have seen with Hondas--(and a couple of Yahamas also) is where the engines are left in the water for the "season"--like the summer--and not rinsed out each time they are used. I believe that as long as you carefully wash the engine, rinse it, and tilt it up, that you will not have any significant problems the length of the time you own the boat. (or for many more years).
 
Bob again hit the nail on the head with the 9.9 Merc. We had one on a 12 foot Alumacraft that we could water ski behind (me at a 90 lbs and the skier at 90 lbs). It was that way in Tennessee at the time to avoid registering the boat since it was under 10 hp.

Motor manufacturers issue horsepower ratings as much for advertising as to meet or avoid regulatory requirements. Having experienced the newer technology of the Honda 90 fuel injected, I can appreciate why the 115 would have a niche. The software controlling the motor dramatically increased fuel flow once a certain load was reached on the engine. With the new 115 I would suspect that load will occur at a higher speed than the typical cruise on the Marinaut. Too bad the CD22 would have a hard time with that much weight on the transom.
 
Curious, where exactly can I find these DYNO tests for the Honda 90 and 115. I have searched all over the web and come up empty; same goes for other outboard manufactures…
 
breausaw":pyvvh9c5 said:
Curious, where exactly can I find these DYNO tests for the Honda 90 and 115. I have searched all over the web and come up empty; same goes for other outboard manufactures…
Click to expand...

Outboard engine manufacturers seem to hide all their horsepower and torque data, keeping the public in the dark and making a mystery out of such data.

It does seem as though they intentionally want to avoid head-to-head factual comparisons between products.

My guess is that they find that factual head-to-head comparison is a very tough world to exist in, since

1. Engine models can change only slowly, due to costs,

2. Outright power comparison is a a deadly game, with usually only a single lone winner, and

3. Worse yet, today's winner can be eclipsed tomorrow with a new model appearing on the market!

I'm guessing they want to avoid this kind of a rat race!

(And it's probably from having tried it before, maybe back in the 1950's or so!)

Nonetheless:

They do show graphs, occasionally, but those are usually without real data, and only are representational, not factual, and certainly not quantitative. (!)

So who starts these "rumors"? Could be anyone, is my guess, but some get picked up and repeated on discussion sites and magazines as though they are real facts.

I wouldn't be surprised if some weren't planned "leaks" by manufacturers to utilize the rumor / magazine / discussion group network as a promotional tool, all the while avoiding factual proof and concrete comparisons.

Someone like Thataway Bob, who participates in several of these types of discussion groups, may have a more accurate picture of how all of this works, and we'll have to wait and see how he or they see it.

So for now, that's my story, and I'm stickin' to it ! :lol:

Joe. :teeth :thup
 
I can't imagine needing 126 hp on the back of a CD 22. For example, with my twin 45s, I can haul 4 normal sized people to the halibut hole (40 mile boat ride) with full gas, minimal water, bait and other necessary gear, and back with ease. And coming back sometimes aint no joke as a LOT of the time we have 8 20-100 pound halibut (I concede I don't catch 100 pounders every trip), a smattering of rock fish, 24 eight to ten pound silvers, a 15-20 pound king or two we lucked our way into, and sometimes a couple of 40 inch ling cod in the mix. I have had so many fish on board before that I end up lying them flat on the boat bottom like cordwood because my two giant coolers were stuffed full. The boat drives like it is loaded, but it still gets up on step and handles like it should. In fact, with a ton of weight in it, the ride in the chop is much better. I honestly don't know how more hp (which costs more money) is going to improve what I have at all.
 
The Honda 115 is a 2.4 litre engine the f-115 Yamaha is a 1.7 litre, the merc 115 is a 1.7 litre detuned verado engine they use this same block to produce up to 200hp . Suzuki 115 is a 2.0 litre.
With the honda using a bigger block and being able to use the better smart tech controls and being able to cruise at lower rpm's it is a winner the biggest problems we have down here in florida is lack of dealers and competion .It seems like a nice motor very expensive compared to other brands .
 
Jennykatz,

You hit the nail on the head: it's a great engine, but it is more expensive then its competitors, and dealer/authorized repair centers are getting harder to find. In my neck of the woods, Connecticut, authorized dealer/repairers are shrinking. It seems that Mercury and Suzuki are taking more market share in our area. It could be that they have more aggressive pricing for the dealers. Regardless, I still wanted a Honda.

Rich
 
I think that Mercury is really is trying to get back market share they just came out with a 3 litre 150 hp to compete with Honda and yamaha . This engine is about the same price of a 115 honda . The problem with them is there Verado lineup is so expensive. they needed to come up with a big litre engine single overhead cam less complicated then the rest I wish them luck . I think they are going the Honda way bringing out a big block 150 hp that can be upgraded to 200hp or more . they wanted an engine that could be a repower with cables instead of smart craft . they were losing to Suzuki and Yamaha .
 
breausaw":17cxo07j said:
Curious, where exactly can I find these DYNO tests for the Honda 90 and 115. I have searched all over the web and come up empty; same goes for other outboard manufactures…
Click to expand...

As Jamie and Adam would say,"This myth is busted".
 
Jay,

Is the myth busted? In the leisure boating article the author Dean Castle stated, "...our review outboard was dyno tested and is actually pumping out 126 HP!" Did his organization contract out to test the motor, or was this information supplied to him by the manufacturer? One thing I can say is that when you pull the throttle all the way back on that 115 HP Honda engine, the boat seems to leap out of its hole.

Rich
 
Sorry to redirect this post but I have to chime in to support the reputation of the newer Honda 90Fi. This is a fine engine based on the Fit automobile motor. It does not have a reputation for premature failure and is in fact quite the opposite "very Reliable". I have seen the hour meters of Honda 90Fi engines with more than 3000 trouble free hours.

As for guides "up North" dumping them, that statement sounds much like the rumors spawned concerning reliability of the Honda 225 when it was first introduced. The competition loves to stir up controversy if it benefits their product in the marketplace.

Does anyone here really believe that a company like Honda would continue to produce a product for four years running with a proven early failure rate? The only problem with Honda is that they cost more in most areas of the US. Check the facts, not the rumors.
 
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