I don't usually get involved in the bantering threads but I will pass along my experiences in this case. We bought our 25 in early 07 at the SBS. We bought it from Lake Union Searay so obviously did not have any contact with the factory. Regardless the deal went very smooth and we were happy with the support we recieved from LUSR. I have had several occasions to interact with SS representatives, Bellingham CBGT 09 and the SBS 10. I have found them enthusiastic about C Dory and this owners group. I don't think we as C Brats realize some times how unique our group is in the boat industry. We are not the norm and I think can be overwhelming. From my conversations with SS representatives they do understand the added value of this group but I think they need some time to figure out their role. I think the dating is going well with an engagement and marriage to follow soon.
A lesson to be learned...
- Thread starter JamesTXSD
- Start date
Matt Gurnsey":1a15gv82 said:
Great to hear from the dealer perspective. My apologies if anything I said implied that I am in favor of the factory selling direct. That was not my intent. I was one of those folks who bought from the factory... and even though they stayed in business at the time, when they discontinued factory service, we were out on our own. Of course, living over 1,000 miles from the nearest dealer pretty much puts me on my own, anyway.
OK, another clarification: I absolutely would have bought from a dealer if there had been one anywhere in reasonable distance. When I contacted the factory at the time, I was told, "We will be your dealer since you don't have one anywhere near you. We will be here to take care of you."
Matt, we WANT you to stay in business. No one is looking to take ANY business away from you. I'm simply stating what went down when the factory decided to no longer deal directly with customers. It was the beginning of the end and a clear indication of their direction. Come on, it isn't like I was going to haul my boat 2600 miles for an oil change. BUT, since they were my dealer, I would have appreciated getting a phone call returned. I am certain you don't treat your customers that way.
So, now it seems that I've ticked off the new factory folks and an esteemed dealer... completely without intention. I simply was stating how a lack of attention to customers can lead to ruin. I whole-heartedly support what you and the factory are doing. I appreciate your participation here. Hopefully, it brings you business.
Frankly, I have no idea if Ranger sells boats direct or services them at the factory. If they promise they do and then don't, that would be bad business. BUT, even though there are Ranger dealers around the country, I still hear lots of good comments about the customer support FROM Ranger. It makes people believe that the factory folks support their dealers AND their customers. Thus, my comparison of the diverging direction of the two different factories.
For the record, the 2009 NuWa (pronounced New Way) that we bought was ordered/purchased from a dealer after visiting the factory. That was one of the best delivery experiences we've had on any purchase.
I really intend to be quiet, but I'm concerned that there are things being read into what I wrote that was never intended. My lament was about customer service and how two different companies handled (past tense) it. Obviously, a lot of us are very passionate about this topic. That in itself should speak volumes.
So... I hope your time at the SBS ultimately results in improved sales. Had I been there, I would have been standing right beside you to encourage folks to see all that the C-Dory offers. A good dealer certainly makes all the difference... if I could go back and do my C-Dory buying experience all over again, I would definitely do it different. Oh, I'd buy the same boat.
Respectfully,
Jim Bathurst
I am against direct selling from the factory--on any product, and fully support the local dealer system. However, our world is changing rapidly. Internet sales of marine products has driven any number of brick and mortar companies out of business.
As several other C Brats, I participate in a number of other forums. If there is a major problem with a boat--it comes down to the factory to either pay for the repair or take the boat back for repair at the factory. The companies which get the best ratings from the general customers--and the internet readership is huge--are those which support their products fully. Some companies have presence on the non brand specific forums, and not only does this give them business directly, but re-assures those who buy the products that this company stands behind the product and greatly increases their sales. Granted that many companies have not caught on to this yet. But it is not the wave of the future, it is what is successful now.
Definately dealers--such as Matt and Wefing's presence on this forum contributes to their business and to the reputation of the product in general. There are some dealers who do not have as good a reputation--and they hurt the brand. There was talk about the Ranger Tug brand. I was at a boat show in S. Florida. There is a dealer there who has the Ranger brand, had a large poster display, but no boat at the show. Because of the way that company responded to their customers and showed their boats, I would not buy from that dealer, and it gives the Ranger brand a bad reputation (even worse for the brand they had on display). So any personal interaction with dealers and company reps can be positive or negative.
As for giving more work to the dealers--many of us are not geographically close to dealers, and may not have had good experiences dealing with some local repair facilities. Just because a dealer sells boats, it does not mean that they have the expertise or personal to do proper repairs.
We all hope that the marine industry pulls out of the slump--but the reality is that discresionary spending is in peril for some time. We still have high unempolyment, the stock market and commedies are down, Taxes are going to be significantly higher, and credit is difficult to obtain. So we have to ask what makes a business survive under these conditions?
As several other C Brats, I participate in a number of other forums. If there is a major problem with a boat--it comes down to the factory to either pay for the repair or take the boat back for repair at the factory. The companies which get the best ratings from the general customers--and the internet readership is huge--are those which support their products fully. Some companies have presence on the non brand specific forums, and not only does this give them business directly, but re-assures those who buy the products that this company stands behind the product and greatly increases their sales. Granted that many companies have not caught on to this yet. But it is not the wave of the future, it is what is successful now.
Definately dealers--such as Matt and Wefing's presence on this forum contributes to their business and to the reputation of the product in general. There are some dealers who do not have as good a reputation--and they hurt the brand. There was talk about the Ranger Tug brand. I was at a boat show in S. Florida. There is a dealer there who has the Ranger brand, had a large poster display, but no boat at the show. Because of the way that company responded to their customers and showed their boats, I would not buy from that dealer, and it gives the Ranger brand a bad reputation (even worse for the brand they had on display). So any personal interaction with dealers and company reps can be positive or negative.
As for giving more work to the dealers--many of us are not geographically close to dealers, and may not have had good experiences dealing with some local repair facilities. Just because a dealer sells boats, it does not mean that they have the expertise or personal to do proper repairs.
We all hope that the marine industry pulls out of the slump--but the reality is that discresionary spending is in peril for some time. We still have high unempolyment, the stock market and commedies are down, Taxes are going to be significantly higher, and credit is difficult to obtain. So we have to ask what makes a business survive under these conditions?
I felt the need to pipe in here as a prospective buyer. To be quite frank I have been looking at a number of vessels and was actually up at the Seattle Boat Show this past weekend where I spent time looking at both the C-Dory, Sea Sport, and Ranger Tug lines and talking with the folks there.
I will say this, my uncle has a CD22 and I am pretty familiar with the brand. I've been lurking on these forums along with the forums over at Tug Nuts for about a year.
Just like C-Brats, Tug Nuts are pretty fanatical about their ownership and rightly so. Both are wonderful vessels with very strong communities behind them.
Ranger is by no means perfect in my mind. If you head over to Tug Nuts you will actually see a post I made last night about the hull layup of the rangers and some questions I posed. I am no fan boy of any brand when I am evaluating purchasing decisions. However, they do have some things going for them that Sea Sport could impliment with the owners group here.
Some really valid points have been made in this thread. Nobody wants to see dealers go out of business. You are a resource that we turn to in times of trouble and need and if you treat us right from purchase to purchase we will spread the word about how wonderful you were to work with and how we were treated right. Even if things aren't always fixed to our liking, if a sincere and valid effort is made, you have made a customer for life. However, when a customer feels abandoned by either the dealer or the factory, or worse, both. Then sales plummit, that enthusiasm stops, and that word stops being spread.
I think Jim hit it right on the head... these forums matter and factory participation matters. The reality is that the internet is the FIRST place people look to do research on a new product. This is even more true on a large purchase like a boat. How active and supportive the community is and how much support they get from dealers and the factory speaks volumes about what the ownership experience will be like and what to expect down the road when things go wrong or break, which they inevitably will with a boat.
It was INCREDIBLY refreshing to meet Jeff Messmer and Andrew Curtis at the Ranger exhibit at the Seattle Boat show and put a name to a "poster" so to speak. You really did walk away from their booth feeling like these guys are VERY active in their product and what that experience will be. Jeff even attempted to steer me towards a used 2008 R-25 model in order to save me some dollars as the owner was putting it up on the market because they moved up to the R-29. That sort of shocked me. I sat down with both of those guys for about 20 minutes a piece and asked them about sales figures, lead times, etc. I also asked them about the issues they experienced with the whole cummins diesel fiasco and they were nothing but frank with me. Mind you, all of this is happening as their booth was packed with people. They certainly made me feel like it was worth the drive up from Portland. Did I experience the same level of interest from the C-Dory and Sea Sport guys. Actually I did. They were just as helpful and willing to talk. The difference was that I "knew" Jeff and Andrew before heading to the show... why... because of the factory's active participation in forums like these. It just makes it feel like they are involved in the process and are ALWAYS available to support owners. Something that is a VERY big deal when you are dealing with purchases north of $100K.
One thing I did take away from SBS is that the Ranger group is certainly doing rather well. They have no debt load, are privately held, and have sold quite a few boats. They only sell factory direct in Oregon, Washington, and Idaho. They have 28 dealers nationwide, which is a very good thing.
I was told about 240 R-25s have been sold since 2006, 40 R-29s have been sold since last its debut last year and at the show this year they had sold 15 of the new R-25SC models and had pretty much filled up production of the R-25 and R-29 line for the rest of the year. If that doesn't say something, I'm not sure what does... I'm still shocked they have sold as many as they have in an economic climate as bad as this. I feel that they are a bit over priced to be quite frank, but clearly they have a winning formula that is working well for them.
I hope that Sea Sport takes note and becomes just as active in these forums... it can't be anything but a benefit to both owners, prospective buyers, AND dealers. I know it is certainly a big deal to prospective buyers like me and I know I am not the only one.
Rgds,
Jack
I will say this, my uncle has a CD22 and I am pretty familiar with the brand. I've been lurking on these forums along with the forums over at Tug Nuts for about a year.
Just like C-Brats, Tug Nuts are pretty fanatical about their ownership and rightly so. Both are wonderful vessels with very strong communities behind them.
Ranger is by no means perfect in my mind. If you head over to Tug Nuts you will actually see a post I made last night about the hull layup of the rangers and some questions I posed. I am no fan boy of any brand when I am evaluating purchasing decisions. However, they do have some things going for them that Sea Sport could impliment with the owners group here.
Some really valid points have been made in this thread. Nobody wants to see dealers go out of business. You are a resource that we turn to in times of trouble and need and if you treat us right from purchase to purchase we will spread the word about how wonderful you were to work with and how we were treated right. Even if things aren't always fixed to our liking, if a sincere and valid effort is made, you have made a customer for life. However, when a customer feels abandoned by either the dealer or the factory, or worse, both. Then sales plummit, that enthusiasm stops, and that word stops being spread.
I think Jim hit it right on the head... these forums matter and factory participation matters. The reality is that the internet is the FIRST place people look to do research on a new product. This is even more true on a large purchase like a boat. How active and supportive the community is and how much support they get from dealers and the factory speaks volumes about what the ownership experience will be like and what to expect down the road when things go wrong or break, which they inevitably will with a boat.
It was INCREDIBLY refreshing to meet Jeff Messmer and Andrew Curtis at the Ranger exhibit at the Seattle Boat show and put a name to a "poster" so to speak. You really did walk away from their booth feeling like these guys are VERY active in their product and what that experience will be. Jeff even attempted to steer me towards a used 2008 R-25 model in order to save me some dollars as the owner was putting it up on the market because they moved up to the R-29. That sort of shocked me. I sat down with both of those guys for about 20 minutes a piece and asked them about sales figures, lead times, etc. I also asked them about the issues they experienced with the whole cummins diesel fiasco and they were nothing but frank with me. Mind you, all of this is happening as their booth was packed with people. They certainly made me feel like it was worth the drive up from Portland. Did I experience the same level of interest from the C-Dory and Sea Sport guys. Actually I did. They were just as helpful and willing to talk. The difference was that I "knew" Jeff and Andrew before heading to the show... why... because of the factory's active participation in forums like these. It just makes it feel like they are involved in the process and are ALWAYS available to support owners. Something that is a VERY big deal when you are dealing with purchases north of $100K.
One thing I did take away from SBS is that the Ranger group is certainly doing rather well. They have no debt load, are privately held, and have sold quite a few boats. They only sell factory direct in Oregon, Washington, and Idaho. They have 28 dealers nationwide, which is a very good thing.
I was told about 240 R-25s have been sold since 2006, 40 R-29s have been sold since last its debut last year and at the show this year they had sold 15 of the new R-25SC models and had pretty much filled up production of the R-25 and R-29 line for the rest of the year. If that doesn't say something, I'm not sure what does... I'm still shocked they have sold as many as they have in an economic climate as bad as this. I feel that they are a bit over priced to be quite frank, but clearly they have a winning formula that is working well for them.
I hope that Sea Sport takes note and becomes just as active in these forums... it can't be anything but a benefit to both owners, prospective buyers, AND dealers. I know it is certainly a big deal to prospective buyers like me and I know I am not the only one.
Rgds,
Jack
I spent three days at the boat show looking at cdory seasports and osprey
comparing them talking to the dealer about each boat pros and cons.
what i come away with is seasport there used to fishing boats thats what they know, same with osprey there thinking fish fish fish and go fast so they feel the cdory is not as good a boat but thats because there thinking fish and go fast. they told me they know deep v's . case and point if all you have ever ridden is a honda Gold wing. a kawasaki ninja will not have much appeal. but once you learn the value of the ninja it has its place. So perhap if the Cbrats can educate Seasport that The cdory is a combination fish, cruise, camp, all in one boat like B.m.w 12 R.T. motor cycle. Honda makes bikes for all different markets. Seasport will have to do the same but they may need some help from Cbrats to help them learn and get excited about the Cdory Because You can't sell a product that you dont know and aren't excited about. And there not excited about cdory because it doesn't go fast out to there favorite spot. But teach them and they will come. you taught me and i bought one and i had a deep vee go fast boat too
comparing them talking to the dealer about each boat pros and cons.
what i come away with is seasport there used to fishing boats thats what they know, same with osprey there thinking fish fish fish and go fast so they feel the cdory is not as good a boat but thats because there thinking fish and go fast. they told me they know deep v's . case and point if all you have ever ridden is a honda Gold wing. a kawasaki ninja will not have much appeal. but once you learn the value of the ninja it has its place. So perhap if the Cbrats can educate Seasport that The cdory is a combination fish, cruise, camp, all in one boat like B.m.w 12 R.T. motor cycle. Honda makes bikes for all different markets. Seasport will have to do the same but they may need some help from Cbrats to help them learn and get excited about the Cdory Because You can't sell a product that you dont know and aren't excited about. And there not excited about cdory because it doesn't go fast out to there favorite spot. But teach them and they will come. you taught me and i bought one and i had a deep vee go fast boat too
journey on
New member
I think we, as C-Dory owners are lucky. We've had 2 capable owners pick up the C-Dory line and keep production going. We've all bought our boats, but we do have a place where we can get spares and ask (some) questions. Sea sport has a reputation for good boats, and hopefully C-Dorys (C-Dories?) will continue to be good boats.
Yes, Jeff Messimer is a wonderful guy to deal with, but we've bought our boat. Now what we want is factory support, when and if needed, and it looks as if it's continuing.
Boris
Yes, Jeff Messimer is a wonderful guy to deal with, but we've bought our boat. Now what we want is factory support, when and if needed, and it looks as if it's continuing.
Boris
Well it has been a long time since I have made a comment on this site. The subject has involved Ranger Tugs and really caught my attention.
Jeff and I have developed many strong relationships with C-dory customers and those will never break. I get emails on a regular basis with questions that still come in from current C-dory owners. Never once I have thought to myself, "I am no longer involved with this company so why should I help." Jeff and I provide the support to anyone that asks. Not because we are getting paid to do so, but because we love what we do and we have a serious passion for boats and the owners experience.
I will agree with Matt about selling direct out of the factory when you are in the same territory or even the same state. The reason we sell direct in "Washington" and "Oregon" is because we end up servicing the customer no matter what. When you provide the level of service that I was brought up to provide, it becomes very tough for the customer to keep contact with the dealers when the factory is "just around the corner." This is completely my opinion and certainly agree that the factory should never compete against their dealers.
Thank you to everyone for the compliments of Ranger Tugs and the crew.
-Andrew Custis-
Jeff and I have developed many strong relationships with C-dory customers and those will never break. I get emails on a regular basis with questions that still come in from current C-dory owners. Never once I have thought to myself, "I am no longer involved with this company so why should I help." Jeff and I provide the support to anyone that asks. Not because we are getting paid to do so, but because we love what we do and we have a serious passion for boats and the owners experience.
I will agree with Matt about selling direct out of the factory when you are in the same territory or even the same state. The reason we sell direct in "Washington" and "Oregon" is because we end up servicing the customer no matter what. When you provide the level of service that I was brought up to provide, it becomes very tough for the customer to keep contact with the dealers when the factory is "just around the corner." This is completely my opinion and certainly agree that the factory should never compete against their dealers.
Thank you to everyone for the compliments of Ranger Tugs and the crew.
-Andrew Custis-
Jay said:
#1. no input was requested on the size or style of the lazarette covers (of which there is a ton of comment on this site about)
#2. or of the size of the storage access ports
In another thread on this site, Scott (from Sea Sport) said he checks here weekly, even though he does not always post. I saw the questions about the "C-Dory logo" on the seat backs and though it was a good question, and apparently taken to heart. For me, it is hard to believe that is anyone using the boat would decrease the size of the hatches as much as was done.
Scott indicated in the parallel thread that the aft lazarette covers may be small, and that they would look into possible alternatives. That should be easy, Joel already did that, and 40 or 50 of us have replaced the OEM ones with the proper application covers. He even said that he will start ordering again in April, (now they have a source too :wink
My hats off to Scott and the Sea Sport crew for undertaking the C-Dory revival. I wish them every success, and in many ways think time spent for some factory rep on this site is a good investment. (Look, I just saved them a ton of research, by sharing Joel's cure for lousy, small hatch covers, and yes it will take them 3 minutes to search out the thread, if some other helpful Brat doesn't find it first and link it in a response here.)
Jim, I think your topic is timely, I agree that it is speaking to a management style, and I hope it is taken like you meant it.
Matt, your participation on this site is very helpful and appreciated. I agree that dealers are a valuable asset both here and to each of us as boat owners. If I had found a boat at a dealer when we were looking, we would have gone there, but there were no used boats available through any local dealers at the time. Here is wishing you an upward trending 2010.
The new 22 has some nice improvements, Table and cockpit floor among my favorites. Sounds like the step might get a look at from the SS guys. Maybe they will ask for input on that too.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
#1. no input was requested on the size or style of the lazarette covers (of which there is a ton of comment on this site about)
#2. or of the size of the storage access ports
In another thread on this site, Scott (from Sea Sport) said he checks here weekly, even though he does not always post. I saw the questions about the "C-Dory logo" on the seat backs and though it was a good question, and apparently taken to heart. For me, it is hard to believe that is anyone using the boat would decrease the size of the hatches as much as was done.
Scott indicated in the parallel thread that the aft lazarette covers may be small, and that they would look into possible alternatives. That should be easy, Joel already did that, and 40 or 50 of us have replaced the OEM ones with the proper application covers. He even said that he will start ordering again in April, (now they have a source too :wink
My hats off to Scott and the Sea Sport crew for undertaking the C-Dory revival. I wish them every success, and in many ways think time spent for some factory rep on this site is a good investment. (Look, I just saved them a ton of research, by sharing Joel's cure for lousy, small hatch covers, and yes it will take them 3 minutes to search out the thread, if some other helpful Brat doesn't find it first and link it in a response here.)
Jim, I think your topic is timely, I agree that it is speaking to a management style, and I hope it is taken like you meant it.
Matt, your participation on this site is very helpful and appreciated. I agree that dealers are a valuable asset both here and to each of us as boat owners. If I had found a boat at a dealer when we were looking, we would have gone there, but there were no used boats available through any local dealers at the time. Here is wishing you an upward trending 2010.
The new 22 has some nice improvements, Table and cockpit floor among my favorites. Sounds like the step might get a look at from the SS guys. Maybe they will ask for input on that too.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
jkidd
Active member
One other thing that I see is when Jeff was at C-dory you could open a boating magazine and there was a C-dory add, when jeff move to Ranger you can open a boating magazine and there is an add Ranger Tugs. I haven't seen a add for C-dory in a long time. I found C-dory in a Magazine and then the factory web site and that's where I learned about the C-brats. Word of mouth will probably get you a few sells, but It seems that Jeff and Ranger tugs has found a working formula that sell a lot of boats in rough times. I got 1 year of a 5 year warranty. My salesman was gone 90 days after I bought my boat. The dealer quit saleing C-dory in 1 year, so I have no dealer and it seems like factory is saying they don't want me either. When it comes time to move up I will buy from someone who shows an interest in me and what they sale. If they can't then it's time to move on to someone that does. I only hope that SS will turn things around for C-dory !!!
Jody,
You might be right there, and even a visit to the Sea Sport website home page has no link to, or acknowledgement of, C-Dory. (Yes there is a C-Dory site, but, if you were looking for a Sea Sport type boat with an out board, and had never seen a C-Dory or the name, you might move on to say ... Arima or something.
It is a niche, and there are those who might be looking.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
You might be right there, and even a visit to the Sea Sport website home page has no link to, or acknowledgement of, C-Dory. (Yes there is a C-Dory site, but, if you were looking for a Sea Sport type boat with an out board, and had never seen a C-Dory or the name, you might move on to say ... Arima or something.
It is a niche, and there are those who might be looking.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
Just a few comments from me on this one.
1) The Tugnuts site is a bit different in that the factory guys actually worked with Bill to get it started and (I believe) provide the only financial support for the site. E.g. you don't see ads from others on that site. So this points up two things a) Those guys recognized the value of creating/maintaining a strong relationship with customers and b) they recognized that the web is the way to do that today. One might infer that one of the main things they learned from this site is the potential value of a new site to their new business.
2) I think that limited factory sales may be a good thing in the long run as the factory as a dealer forces the factory to deal more directly with customers. As a result, they see problems first hand and close up. When a problem is seen/fixed at the factory, the guys who created the problem (designers or builders) are more likely to see/know about the problem and correct it more quickly in future builds. I think this results in them making a better boat in the long run. There are other ways to accomplish the same thing - e.g. working with local dealers and having a high level of communication with them.
3) I really like SeaSport and have always admired the build quality of their boats. If someone had asked me 2 years ago "If you could pick the next buyers of C-Dory, who would you want to own it?", I would have answered SeaSport based only on my knowledge of their line, their build quality and their location.
4) As has been said before, it's up to SeaSport to determine how much participation they wish to have here. In the end, what really matters from a business perspective is the return on their investment. E.g. does the time and effort spent participating here result in sales that justify the effort? That's hard to determine as there are other complicating factors (like the economy). However, if they don't do the experiment, no one will ever know. Also, many of us here believe that such efforts will ultimately be rewarded with more sales but we can't offer up any controlled marketing/business studies to demonstrate that. Nonetheless, I think the fact that the Ranger guys have done/are doing so much with the Tugnuts site indicates that they believe it's good for business.
1) The Tugnuts site is a bit different in that the factory guys actually worked with Bill to get it started and (I believe) provide the only financial support for the site. E.g. you don't see ads from others on that site. So this points up two things a) Those guys recognized the value of creating/maintaining a strong relationship with customers and b) they recognized that the web is the way to do that today. One might infer that one of the main things they learned from this site is the potential value of a new site to their new business.
2) I think that limited factory sales may be a good thing in the long run as the factory as a dealer forces the factory to deal more directly with customers. As a result, they see problems first hand and close up. When a problem is seen/fixed at the factory, the guys who created the problem (designers or builders) are more likely to see/know about the problem and correct it more quickly in future builds. I think this results in them making a better boat in the long run. There are other ways to accomplish the same thing - e.g. working with local dealers and having a high level of communication with them.
3) I really like SeaSport and have always admired the build quality of their boats. If someone had asked me 2 years ago "If you could pick the next buyers of C-Dory, who would you want to own it?", I would have answered SeaSport based only on my knowledge of their line, their build quality and their location.
4) As has been said before, it's up to SeaSport to determine how much participation they wish to have here. In the end, what really matters from a business perspective is the return on their investment. E.g. does the time and effort spent participating here result in sales that justify the effort? That's hard to determine as there are other complicating factors (like the economy). However, if they don't do the experiment, no one will ever know. Also, many of us here believe that such efforts will ultimately be rewarded with more sales but we can't offer up any controlled marketing/business studies to demonstrate that. Nonetheless, I think the fact that the Ranger guys have done/are doing so much with the Tugnuts site indicates that they believe it's good for business.
Wow... a lot to read and not a lot of pictures either.
How long till spring time? :hot :hug :hot :hug2 :love
Cabin Fever Anyone? :smileo
Well... just a pic of fun in the sun may help... I will do my part, then come back and read some more after taking my lovely bride to work....in another 4" of snow...
Good stuff here.
Byrdman...with more to say later after I can read it all.... :sad :smile :thup
How long till spring time? :hot :hug :hot :hug2 :love
Cabin Fever Anyone? :smileo
Well... just a pic of fun in the sun may help... I will do my part, then come back and read some more after taking my lovely bride to work....in another 4" of snow...
Good stuff here.
Byrdman...with more to say later after I can read it all.... :sad :smile :thup
jingram":2xklsbjs said:Gorgeous bride, you lucky dog!! I'll take the bridesmaid directly on the right... to go please. Hell, make it two!
Hey, Welcome to the C-Brat site Jack!! I see by your post you have been at least a lurker for some time...knowing Jeff and Andrew and some of the others..... welcome out of the closet! Great to see you posting.
Not sure if we have met or not as I have traveled to the Seattle Boat show several years.
My pic was just meant to break up a bit of ice and get things on here a bit less serious...which I guess I did. Actually, that is my bride on the right(the bridesmaid you referred to), and our daughter is the bride. It was a very frantic and fun time on our TC24 FreeByrd about 20 minutes before the wedding. Delivered bride's side of the wedding party from the boat.
Look forward to reading the proceeding 3 pages...after a nap I think.
Byrdman
Out of courosity I checked the C Dory web site: The first thing I see is "See who we are"--opening the page it says "coming soon"--the same it has said for some months. Then "News" section--same thing "Coming soon". There are some good things--bits of comments from some C brats, but I think that it misses the real versitility of the boat. There should be publicity of the extensive voyages, the advantages of trailerability, and what these boats can really do--such as the expedition a couple of summers down the McKenzie River.
Should there be some mention of C brat gatherings? The forum is linked on the web site.
Also I haven't seen anything here about the C Brat factory tour, which is touted as having occured On Jan 24th this year. Was there a factory tour?
What does it "cost" to update the web site, and make appearances on the web site? The forum is one of the real selling points of the boats and the concept of these boats. In today's economic atmosphere, anything which can be done to increase sales, without incurring more costs is a positive.
We all want Sea Sport to succeed, and this means selling more boats.
Should there be some mention of C brat gatherings? The forum is linked on the web site.
Also I haven't seen anything here about the C Brat factory tour, which is touted as having occured On Jan 24th this year. Was there a factory tour?
What does it "cost" to update the web site, and make appearances on the web site? The forum is one of the real selling points of the boats and the concept of these boats. In today's economic atmosphere, anything which can be done to increase sales, without incurring more costs is a positive.
We all want Sea Sport to succeed, and this means selling more boats.
Matt Gurnsey
New member
I'll agree with Bob- Websites should be updated regularly. Constant pages with missing links or "coming soon" notes are discouraging at best or show a lack of interest by the company at worst.
Lack of factory backed advetising has been harmful as well. Advertising should pique interest, and drive consumers to web sites or dealers. It's hard to measure the effectiveness of image ads, but they do keep the awareness of the brand high. Advertsing also leads to feature articles in magazines, further enhancing brand image and awareness.
Last year Fluid Marine paid for part of the Seattle Boat Show space. This year we were on our own. Sign of the times, unfortunately, but factories just don't have the capital to expend on marketing. Yet if the don't market the boat, then the brand dies.
Websites, factory and owner group, play a role in marketing. But people on Owner Sites already have brand awareness. Marketing to people outside that group is required to grow the brand.
Marketing costs money, which is getting hard to come by in the current climate. Just look at your favorite magazine. Odds are that the page count is down from a year ago due to the reduction in advertising revenue caused by the slumping economy.
So I can understand a factory feeling that participation on an owners forum doesn't grow sales. It may make existing owners feel more involved, but ultimately the goal is to get new buyers to enter the market and buy product. It's kind of like preaching to the converted.
Lack of factory backed advetising has been harmful as well. Advertising should pique interest, and drive consumers to web sites or dealers. It's hard to measure the effectiveness of image ads, but they do keep the awareness of the brand high. Advertsing also leads to feature articles in magazines, further enhancing brand image and awareness.
Last year Fluid Marine paid for part of the Seattle Boat Show space. This year we were on our own. Sign of the times, unfortunately, but factories just don't have the capital to expend on marketing. Yet if the don't market the boat, then the brand dies.
Websites, factory and owner group, play a role in marketing. But people on Owner Sites already have brand awareness. Marketing to people outside that group is required to grow the brand.
Marketing costs money, which is getting hard to come by in the current climate. Just look at your favorite magazine. Odds are that the page count is down from a year ago due to the reduction in advertising revenue caused by the slumping economy.
So I can understand a factory feeling that participation on an owners forum doesn't grow sales. It may make existing owners feel more involved, but ultimately the goal is to get new buyers to enter the market and buy product. It's kind of like preaching to the converted.
Oh boy, now I am REALLY red... open mouth, insert foot kind of moment!! LOL. Well double congratulations to you then!
Jack
Jack
Byrdman":1t7uma2w said:jingram":1t7uma2w said:Gorgeous bride, you lucky dog!! I'll take the bridesmaid directly on the right... to go please. Hell, make it two!
Hey, Welcome to the C-Brat site Jack!! I see by your post you have been at least a lurker for some time...knowing Jeff and Andrew and some of the others..... welcome out of the closet! Great to see you posting.
Not sure if we have met or not as I have traveled to the Seattle Boat show several years.
My pic was just meant to break up a bit of ice and get things on here a bit less serious...which I guess I did. Actually, that is my bride on the right(the bridesmaid you referred to), and our daughter is the bride. It was a very frantic and fun time on our TC24 FreeByrd about 20 minutes before the wedding. Delivered bride's side of the wedding party from the boat.
Look forward to reading the proceeding 3 pages...after a nap I think.
Byrdman
