Thank you for that Sunbeam and all you points are well taken. Possible your biggest reflection is -how long the boat is in the water and when its not in the water how it is stored. However, a chain is only as strong as its weakest link and in this case I refer to the method used to mount the motor. All those who have a dealer or factory mounted motor put you hands up. So while we are worrying about a deck mounting method the motor mount is the weak link if a dealer did it. Do I have an answer here no - its just an oxymoron that intrigues me.Sunbeam":f1giec73 said:
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Bedding for a windlass
- Thread starter AK Angler
- Start date
Just this summer I removed the engine from my transom (just used an engine hoist and moved it away from the transom by a few inches so I could work). I did it for a few reasons, but one of them was because those were the *last* holes in the transom that I had not gone in and closed out the core on.
As expected, there was just a small amount of sealant (even if I were just using sealant I would use much more than I have found on things I have removed - it was a bit skimpy) and then bare balsa core. The core was dry. However, my boat had 50 hours on it when I got it and had been stored indoors, so it was not much of a test. I did of course go ahead and close out the core on all four holes. Not only does it protect the core, but it creates a hard area to tighten fasteners on (soft core can "dimple" when torqued on, although large washers or transom plates can alleviate that).
Where I *did* find wet core, even with the "stored indoors and very few hours" was below the transom drain tube. That does not have a good flange/faying surface, and there was barely any sealant around it (so it could have been better, even with only sealant). At the point where I took it apart there was only around two square inches of damp core, so it was easily removed and would have been taken out anyway for my epoxying (I completely removed the core in this area and went to a garboard drain style plug, as shown in the Sunbeam ~ 22 Cruiser thread). I would not have wanted to see it years later if I had not done anything and had kept the boat in the water, but I can't say for sure what it would have looked like since that never happened. The engine bracket has a much larger faying surface than that brass tube did.
Again, you are correct in that our 99% of our engines are installed by just drilling through the core and using sealant. And obviously the boats don't instantly melt. I'd pay special attention to it if I were keeping a boat in a slip, even if I were not "anal" me. For me even though I store it indoors when not in use, I just wanted to be able to relax and not think about it if, say, I did The Great Loop and wanted the boat in the water for months on end.
Some of the boats (likely 2006 and newer) have foam cored transoms. The foam is likely more water resistant than balsa (although balsa is pretty good in that respect, really), but it is still in my opinion a bad idea to let water get in because there are nearly always small voids in the core-to-laminates bond area, and water in between them running around may have a part in de-bonding, and well, just better to keep any cored structure dry inside.
If you keep your boat indoors or covered, and don't use it for more than a few weeks at a time (this is likely typical for many), you can "get away with" a lot and likely never have any problem. After all, people make cardboard boats and race them -- they just don't keep them in the water for long (and obviously any C-Dory is miles better than cardboard; I wasn't implying any connection - just stating an extreme to illustrate).
My thoughts anyway,
Sunbeam
As expected, there was just a small amount of sealant (even if I were just using sealant I would use much more than I have found on things I have removed - it was a bit skimpy) and then bare balsa core. The core was dry. However, my boat had 50 hours on it when I got it and had been stored indoors, so it was not much of a test. I did of course go ahead and close out the core on all four holes. Not only does it protect the core, but it creates a hard area to tighten fasteners on (soft core can "dimple" when torqued on, although large washers or transom plates can alleviate that).
Where I *did* find wet core, even with the "stored indoors and very few hours" was below the transom drain tube. That does not have a good flange/faying surface, and there was barely any sealant around it (so it could have been better, even with only sealant). At the point where I took it apart there was only around two square inches of damp core, so it was easily removed and would have been taken out anyway for my epoxying (I completely removed the core in this area and went to a garboard drain style plug, as shown in the Sunbeam ~ 22 Cruiser thread). I would not have wanted to see it years later if I had not done anything and had kept the boat in the water, but I can't say for sure what it would have looked like since that never happened. The engine bracket has a much larger faying surface than that brass tube did.
Again, you are correct in that our 99% of our engines are installed by just drilling through the core and using sealant. And obviously the boats don't instantly melt. I'd pay special attention to it if I were keeping a boat in a slip, even if I were not "anal" me. For me even though I store it indoors when not in use, I just wanted to be able to relax and not think about it if, say, I did The Great Loop and wanted the boat in the water for months on end.
Some of the boats (likely 2006 and newer) have foam cored transoms. The foam is likely more water resistant than balsa (although balsa is pretty good in that respect, really), but it is still in my opinion a bad idea to let water get in because there are nearly always small voids in the core-to-laminates bond area, and water in between them running around may have a part in de-bonding, and well, just better to keep any cored structure dry inside.
If you keep your boat indoors or covered, and don't use it for more than a few weeks at a time (this is likely typical for many), you can "get away with" a lot and likely never have any problem. After all, people make cardboard boats and race them -- they just don't keep them in the water for long (and obviously any C-Dory is miles better than cardboard; I wasn't implying any connection - just stating an extreme to illustrate).
My thoughts anyway,
Sunbeam
Hey Sunbeam your a great logical corespondent --Sunbeam":37phhg07 said:Just this summer I removed the engine from my transom (just used an engine hoist and moved it away from the transom by a few inches so I could work). I did it for a few reasons, but one of them was because those were the *last* holes in the transom that I had not gone in and closed out the core on.
As expected, there was just a small amount of sealant (even if I were just using sealant I would use much more than I have found on things I have removed - it was a bit skimpy) and then bare balsa core. The core was dry. However, my boat had 50 hours on it when I got it and had been stored indoors, so it was not much of a test. I did of course go ahead and close out the core on all four holes. Not only does it protect the core, but it creates a hard area to tighten fasteners on (soft core can "dimple" when torqued on, although large washers or transom plates can alleviate that).
Where I *did* find wet core, even with the "stored indoors and very few hours" was below the transom drain tube. That does not have a good flange/faying surface, and there was barely any sealant around it (so it could have been better, even with only sealant). At the point where I took it apart there was only around two square inches of damp core, so it was easily removed and would have been taken out anyway for my epoxying (I completely removed the core in this area and went to a garboard drain style plug, as shown in the Sunbeam ~ 22 Cruiser thread). I would not have wanted to see it years later if I had not done anything and had kept the boat in the water, but I can't say for sure what it would have looked like since that never happened. The engine bracket has a much larger faying surface than that brass tube did.
Again, you are correct in that our 99% of our engines are installed by just drilling through the core and using sealant. And obviously the boats don't instantly melt. I'd pay special attention to it if I were keeping a boat in a slip, even if I were not "anal" me. For me even though I store it indoors when not in use, I just wanted to be able to relax and not think about it if, say, I did The Great Loop and wanted the boat in the water for months on end.
Some of the boats (likely 2006 and newer) have foam cored transoms. The foam is likely more water resistant than balsa (although balsa is pretty good in that respect, really), but it is still in my opinion a bad idea to let water get in because there are nearly always small voids in the core-to-laminates bond area, and water in between them running around may have a part in de-bonding, and well, just better to keep any cored structure dry inside.
If you keep your boat indoors or covered, and don't use it for more than a few weeks at a time (this is likely typical for many), you can "get away with" a lot and likely never have any problem. After all, people make cardboard boats and race them -- they just don't keep them in the water for long (and obviously any C-Dory is miles better than cardboard; I wasn't implying any connection - just stating an extreme to illustrate).
My thoughts anyway,
Sunbeam
I am going to close this off by saying this-- there are a good, better, best, method- IMO:
Good - drill and caulk
better - drill, caulk liberally and store many ashore on a trailer
best-- your at home with love method - drill oversize - epoxy and re-drill - etc.