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Boat Ladders
- Thread starter Tug
- Start date
Tug":33evh8k0 said:Was thinking on purchasing a 4 step gunnel hook boarding ladder.The gunnel hooks come in two sizes, 7 inch and 11 inch, which hook size is appropriate for a 22 foot C-Dory. Thanks Tug
Tug,
Assuming
1) you are looking at the Garelick boarding ladders and
2) The "hook size" refers to the height of the top of the bend above the gunwale,
then I think the 7" is correct. I'm sure I didn't have 11" on the one that came with my previous 22.
Tug,
I took some time to look at the Garelick ladders. Upon going through their products online, I realize the the "hook kind" are meant to just hook over the gunwale. I wouldn't recommend that. The ones the factory supplies are not the hook kind but are rather the latch type like these. I think the 3 step ladder is what the factory used but it might be the 4 step. Perhaps someone else can confirm. I think the positive latch system is much safer and easier to use than the hook kind.
I took some time to look at the Garelick ladders. Upon going through their products online, I realize the the "hook kind" are meant to just hook over the gunwale. I wouldn't recommend that. The ones the factory supplies are not the hook kind but are rather the latch type like these. I think the 3 step ladder is what the factory used but it might be the 4 step. Perhaps someone else can confirm. I think the positive latch system is much safer and easier to use than the hook kind.
This is on my spring to do list also. Yes, you do need the kind with hooks (or buttons on the end) as the others are meant for a pontoon boat or to hook over a gunnel. Without the buttons in the anchors it would skid off the deck of a C Dory when you are half way up. I had the same kind of ladder on my last boat. My bulk (230 lbs) is marginal for this ladder, but your options are limited. It didn't break, but wiggled & twisted a bit much. I measured the length needed when my boat was bow-on the beach at Lk Powell last fall and you need four steps. I'm going to put one anchor plate on each side of the rear stanchion of the bow rail. That means four anchor plates, it comes with two.
I emailed Garlick for a dealer as I could not find it listed in any of the online catalogs I checkd. Garlick responded with a list of dealers, so I'm ordering Garlick No 12350 from Fisheries Supply. http://www.fisheriessupply.com/productg ... ing+ladder Their online catalog says they don't stock it but can order it.
Chuck Raddon, Orofino Idaho
I emailed Garlick for a dealer as I could not find it listed in any of the online catalogs I checkd. Garlick responded with a list of dealers, so I'm ordering Garlick No 12350 from Fisheries Supply. http://www.fisheriessupply.com/productg ... ing+ladder Their online catalog says they don't stock it but can order it.
Chuck Raddon, Orofino Idaho
This last weekend I had occasion to ride with DaveS on SeaShift and he has the Garlick ladders that clip into the attached key-hole type receptacle. That works great for in and egress to the cockpit.
On SleepyC I have the hook type ladder, I believe it is the 11" version, 4 step. It works on either side of the cockpit, and if needed, can be deployed over the gunnel and into the water for boarding from the water side, either in the water or from a dingy. One item works for two jobs in four places. I like that.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
On SleepyC I have the hook type ladder, I believe it is the 11" version, 4 step. It works on either side of the cockpit, and if needed, can be deployed over the gunnel and into the water for boarding from the water side, either in the water or from a dingy. One item works for two jobs in four places. I like that.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
Yellowstone
New member
Tug - Have had experience with two different systems for a 22' the divers ladder and the hook ladder. The divers ladder requires a bracket on the sides; the hook ladder hooks into the key hole bracket on top of the gunwales. Both work well depending on your purpose.
The most versatile is the hook ladder. If you go that way, the West Marine stainless steel ladder available at the factory - 4-step folding with standoffs ladder is best. When not in use, it can be reversed and hangs inside. With two sets of brackets - one for port and starboad, it switches from side to side. It will easy support a big man. 29 " folded length; 46" extended length: 14" wide. Avoid an aluminum ladder - not strong enough.
The hook ladder can be just dropped over the gunwale in an emergency when location of brackets is not handy and time is of the essence. We saved my friend with this ladder when he fell overboard without a life jacket on when docking. He had an undiscovered brain tumor which caused him to become unconscious bending over the gunwale. With the ladder over the gunwale and a boat hook to drag him to it, he became conscious enough to grab the ladder, and then it was a struggle to get him aboard, but we did it. Without the ladder, I'm not sure we could have saved him. Unfortunately, the story has a sad ending. He had several surgeries, but his tumor was the worst kind - and he didn't live long.
John
The most versatile is the hook ladder. If you go that way, the West Marine stainless steel ladder available at the factory - 4-step folding with standoffs ladder is best. When not in use, it can be reversed and hangs inside. With two sets of brackets - one for port and starboad, it switches from side to side. It will easy support a big man. 29 " folded length; 46" extended length: 14" wide. Avoid an aluminum ladder - not strong enough.
The hook ladder can be just dropped over the gunwale in an emergency when location of brackets is not handy and time is of the essence. We saved my friend with this ladder when he fell overboard without a life jacket on when docking. He had an undiscovered brain tumor which caused him to become unconscious bending over the gunwale. With the ladder over the gunwale and a boat hook to drag him to it, he became conscious enough to grab the ladder, and then it was a struggle to get him aboard, but we did it. Without the ladder, I'm not sure we could have saved him. Unfortunately, the story has a sad ending. He had several surgeries, but his tumor was the worst kind - and he didn't live long.
John
An alternative idea might be a rope ladder. We had a hook ladder and it was a pain to store and we never actually use it.
This is what we carry now and it works fine in practice on our 25. One side (shorter) clips to the starboard or port railing at the side entrances to the cockpit. The other (longer) clips to the hand hold at either side mounted standard to the aft corners of the cabin. I keep a couple of large stainless clips o the ends and it stores rolled up in one of the cockpit side pockets. Ready to use but not normally needed.
http://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/40054072
This is what we carry now and it works fine in practice on our 25. One side (shorter) clips to the starboard or port railing at the side entrances to the cockpit. The other (longer) clips to the hand hold at either side mounted standard to the aft corners of the cabin. I keep a couple of large stainless clips o the ends and it stores rolled up in one of the cockpit side pockets. Ready to use but not normally needed.
http://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/40054072
The problem with rope ladders is that they do not allow the rungs to stand out enough from the hull, and are a bit unstable. They also tend to swing side to side, and if below the bottom of the boat, go under the boat. If you want to use a rope ladder, consider one with 4 ropes, and platform type of rungs.--this is much safer and easier to use--not much more room to store.
Let me add one more consideration:
If you're by yourself and fall overboard, any ladder that you can't reach from the water is worthless.
You need one attached to a swim platform or some other type, such as one affixed to the transom directly that folds down.
Also keep in mind that you may be cold, tired, or in some state of shock and not fully capable of climbing with all your normal strength and agility.
And as we age and (for some of us, anyway) get heavier, less agile and muscular, climbing out of the water fully clothed becomes a more and more difficult task.
I can tell that the difference in my case is considerable between the time I retired ten years ago and the present. And if I lived in the PNW, I might not have ever gotten into the water to find out, but here on Shasta Lake where the water temperature reaches 78 or more degrees in the summer, one gets wet a lot just to cool down. Have you tried to use a ladder to re-enter the boat lately?
And what Bob says about wide platform steps and stand-offs is really important: you don't what to be fighting a cheap ladder while you're trying to save your own life.
I've got a three step one on the transom of my boat for emergencies and another four step one kept inside for swimming, since it's easier not to have to re-enter over the transom, engine well, and mounted cooler!
If i'd thought about it, the ladder off my bow for beach access when ashore would have another rung or two to to be deep enough in the water to allow entry from the water in an emergency.
Joe. :teeth :thup
If you're by yourself and fall overboard, any ladder that you can't reach from the water is worthless.
You need one attached to a swim platform or some other type, such as one affixed to the transom directly that folds down.
Also keep in mind that you may be cold, tired, or in some state of shock and not fully capable of climbing with all your normal strength and agility.
And as we age and (for some of us, anyway) get heavier, less agile and muscular, climbing out of the water fully clothed becomes a more and more difficult task.
I can tell that the difference in my case is considerable between the time I retired ten years ago and the present. And if I lived in the PNW, I might not have ever gotten into the water to find out, but here on Shasta Lake where the water temperature reaches 78 or more degrees in the summer, one gets wet a lot just to cool down. Have you tried to use a ladder to re-enter the boat lately?
And what Bob says about wide platform steps and stand-offs is really important: you don't what to be fighting a cheap ladder while you're trying to save your own life.
I've got a three step one on the transom of my boat for emergencies and another four step one kept inside for swimming, since it's easier not to have to re-enter over the transom, engine well, and mounted cooler!
If i'd thought about it, the ladder off my bow for beach access when ashore would have another rung or two to to be deep enough in the water to allow entry from the water in an emergency.
Joe. :teeth :thup
Rope ladders come in many forms and and actually test right up there with rigid ladders for ease of use in many circumstances. What is really important is a good handhold. That is the great thing about rigid ladders. They provide a good handhold to grip while using your feet to lift.
This particular rope ladder has big plastic rings at each rung to hold it away from the boat and the slab sided 25 is a good wall for climbing support. The low stainless cockpit rail is a great handhold and really makes it easy enough for us. A rigid ladder would be easier for many but so would many other contraptions that take up space. I don't boat alone unless something has gone horribly wrong.
This rope ladder is to board the boat in case of a fall or if there is a rare swimmer in the water. As a backup, I have two permatrims with griptape hanging off the back and two outboards to brace yourself on as you walk between them.
Now if you picked up our boat and dropped it in the Florida Keys, swimming may be a regular enough activity that a more accomodating ladder with optional slide would be nice. /i would likely bolt on a few more stainless handholds just for ease of ingress as well. For now, the water is either cold or really cold nearly everywhere salty up here. Hotsprings excluded.
This particular rope ladder has big plastic rings at each rung to hold it away from the boat and the slab sided 25 is a good wall for climbing support. The low stainless cockpit rail is a great handhold and really makes it easy enough for us. A rigid ladder would be easier for many but so would many other contraptions that take up space. I don't boat alone unless something has gone horribly wrong.
This rope ladder is to board the boat in case of a fall or if there is a rare swimmer in the water. As a backup, I have two permatrims with griptape hanging off the back and two outboards to brace yourself on as you walk between them.
Now if you picked up our boat and dropped it in the Florida Keys, swimming may be a regular enough activity that a more accomodating ladder with optional slide would be nice. /i would likely bolt on a few more stainless handholds just for ease of ingress as well. For now, the water is either cold or really cold nearly everywhere salty up here. Hotsprings excluded.
Age and fitness is why i think a boat ladder is a good idea.I am 60 in April, still young but with neck and back problems,spinal stenosis on both, i used to be able to grab hold and pull myself back on to a boat, but i do not know about now.I can not swim very far either, so this year a boarding ladder is essential for the safely of myself and any others on my boat. Tug
Sea Wolf":3ich8ive said:Let me add one more consideration:
If you're by yourself and fall overboard, any ladder that you can't reach from the water is worthless.
You need one attached to a swim platform or some other type, such as one affixed to the transom directly that folds down.
You nailed it. I can't imagine going out on a boat solo, with no way to get back aboard if you go over, 10x so when boating in frigid waters. Not a nice way to die...although considered to be painless after you give-up...as reported by near-deaths by hypothermia.
The ladder needs to be deployable from the water, and must have enough rungs (and stability) to allow you to re-board under adverse circumstances, like soaking wet in 34-degree water while wearing a down parka and heavy boots...assuming the boat hasn't already drifted away from you with wind or current...
Yellowstone
New member
My comment relates to falling over board solo w/o a ladder employed or having a swim step with fold up ladder attached to the transom on a C-Dory. If the motor is in gear bid your self good bye.
But if it is not in gear or not running, and if you have tabs installed, work your way to the rear and step on one (it will give a little bit) and reach up and grab the cleat as a handle, press your opposite hand against the engine, and hoist yourself into the well. I have practice that several times and it works. If your 22' is a 1999 or earlier model, the cleat orientation is perfect -port/starboard. Later models inherited the factory going stupid with the cleats rigged north and south. If I had those later models, I would have a rope circle hanging down from the cleats for easy grabbing. At a time like that who cares about looks!
Try it sometimes when you are in shallow water and get the hang of it.
John
But if it is not in gear or not running, and if you have tabs installed, work your way to the rear and step on one (it will give a little bit) and reach up and grab the cleat as a handle, press your opposite hand against the engine, and hoist yourself into the well. I have practice that several times and it works. If your 22' is a 1999 or earlier model, the cleat orientation is perfect -port/starboard. Later models inherited the factory going stupid with the cleats rigged north and south. If I had those later models, I would have a rope circle hanging down from the cleats for easy grabbing. At a time like that who cares about looks!
Try it sometimes when you are in shallow water and get the hang of it.
John
Yellowstone
New member
Joe - I didn't know that. Perhaps Tyboo has the answer to our question. Someone on this site has the answer, The change must have occurred when the factory went to the over lapping lids.I rarely see older models like yours. Looks like Shasta is up now. John
Karl makes an excellent point about the ladder being deployable from the water and that is why both of our boats have ladders which can be used this way.
There is anothe way "up" and that is to put your weight on the cavitation plate of the engine, and hit the "up" switch, this bringing your bocy upward, and then into the boat.
Thru the years I have used rope ladders, with proper steps and standoffs, but then I was younger and had much better strength--today I could not get aboard using one of these. Having stand off rings (which appear rather small in the photos)--does not address the problem of the lower rungs swinging under the boat. It assumes that you have the rung your foot is upon is against the hull. When the rungs swing under the boat, then the angle of your climb becomes very difficult; with enough upper body strength you may be able to board.
There is anothe way "up" and that is to put your weight on the cavitation plate of the engine, and hit the "up" switch, this bringing your bocy upward, and then into the boat.
Thru the years I have used rope ladders, with proper steps and standoffs, but then I was younger and had much better strength--today I could not get aboard using one of these. Having stand off rings (which appear rather small in the photos)--does not address the problem of the lower rungs swinging under the boat. It assumes that you have the rung your foot is upon is against the hull. When the rungs swing under the boat, then the angle of your climb becomes very difficult; with enough upper body strength you may be able to board.
jacuthbert
New member
The description of getting back on the boat from the water, using the trim tab as a step sounds like a great idea. You say you have practiced it many times...I want to try it too, but I weigh almost 210 and I am concerned that practice will damage the tab. Of course, in an emergency, who cares if a tab gets bent or ruined?
I have a hooked ladder which I store on top of my C-Dory 25 cabin. I hang it over the gunwales when swimming, and I hang it over the bow rails to get on and off the boat when the bow is on shore. It has worked well so far, although I worry about the strength of the bow rails with my weight.
I know I should get skinnyer and a lot of my problems would be solved, but I do so like my steak and lobster.
Amanda
I have a hooked ladder which I store on top of my C-Dory 25 cabin. I hang it over the gunwales when swimming, and I hang it over the bow rails to get on and off the boat when the bow is on shore. It has worked well so far, although I worry about the strength of the bow rails with my weight.
I know I should get skinnyer and a lot of my problems would be solved, but I do so like my steak and lobster.
Amanda