Anita Marie
New member
I know this has been hashed over before but I can't find it in the search. When I remove the plug to launch the boat the brakes lock up immediatley in reverse. So what am I doing wrong?
Brakes locking up in reverse with plug off
- Thread starter Anita Marie
- Start date
Removing the plug.
You have to have 12v going to the lockout solenoid to back up. The King trailer does not have a mechanical stop that I know of to keep the brakes locked out.
If you really want, you can back right down to the edge of the water, remove the plug with the trailer on the ramp slope, and let it and the truck roll back from there. Then replug the lights at the top of the ramp. But that's too much of a pain for me. The lights are in supposedly sealed bubbles, and mine have never burned out from the water.
You could rig up a jumper from the truck's backup lights to the solenoid valve. Or you could drill a hole through the surge actuator for a pin to keep it from moving. But even as much as I like gadgets I think either of those would be too much hassle. The light assemblies cost twenty bucks, and in a few years they will probably burn out on their own anyway.
Besides, the red lights are kinda pretty in the water.
I agree with Mike, don't unplug the trailer!
Also, once the angle of the ramp makes it so you don't need reverse pop the truck in nuetral. That way you will have all 4 truck wheels braking for you rather than just the fronts. And it will be a simple matter to drop it in drive if needed. On a stick I usually put it in first gear with my foot on the clutch. The last thing you want is to power yourself down into the water while launching because the ramp is too slippery for only having brakes on the front wheels.
Also, once the angle of the ramp makes it so you don't need reverse pop the truck in nuetral. That way you will have all 4 truck wheels braking for you rather than just the fronts. And it will be a simple matter to drop it in drive if needed. On a stick I usually put it in first gear with my foot on the clutch. The last thing you want is to power yourself down into the water while launching because the ramp is too slippery for only having brakes on the front wheels.
starcrafttom
Active member
I never unplug the lights, but if you want you can unplug and stick a rod in the space just in front of the control box. How do I explain this? There are two half moon metal things coming out of the front of the control box. there is room between the inside of them and the control box. if you put a rod in that gap, then the cup part of the hitch can not move backwards and can not engage the brakes. then you can unplug and back up. It shows how in the trailers owners manual I think.
Roger -
Pretty sure he has the same trailer I have. They're surge brakes. There is a solenoid valve in the pressure line that is activated by the truck's backup light circuit to close the flow to the brake calipers, so when it is backing up the brakes will not function.
Luna C is right on with his suggestion, unless there are cleats or other bumps on the ramp that allow the truck to overtake the trailer when coasting backward. Once the brake is applied, you usually have to go forward to pull the surge mechanism free because the disc brakes will not allow the boat to roll away from the truck. It can be a real pain. Nine times out of ten, though, it never hangs up. Obviously, Fred is lower than 90%. Maybe because he is unplugging before he is steep enough for gravity to do its thing.
Another problem Fred has is the sheer power of the Cummins deisel. If the truck is in gear, all you have to do is breathe on the throttle and nothing will stop it.
Pretty sure he has the same trailer I have. They're surge brakes. There is a solenoid valve in the pressure line that is activated by the truck's backup light circuit to close the flow to the brake calipers, so when it is backing up the brakes will not function.
Luna C is right on with his suggestion, unless there are cleats or other bumps on the ramp that allow the truck to overtake the trailer when coasting backward. Once the brake is applied, you usually have to go forward to pull the surge mechanism free because the disc brakes will not allow the boat to roll away from the truck. It can be a real pain. Nine times out of ten, though, it never hangs up. Obviously, Fred is lower than 90%. Maybe because he is unplugging before he is steep enough for gravity to do its thing.
Another problem Fred has is the sheer power of the Cummins deisel. If the truck is in gear, all you have to do is breathe on the throttle and nothing will stop it.
So the King surge brakes operate quite a bit differently than the EZ loader... The problem I have with the EZ loader is backing it in to a slightly up-hill spot that has a short downhill run first. I engage the lock but unless I can do it all in one smooth motion (which happens roughly 0% of the time), the latch disengages and I have to hop out to re-engage it (usually several times during the process of putting it in the driveway). I was think that perhaps this problem could only be solved with electric brakes but it sounds like the king setup is better and would alleviate my problem (if it could be mounted on my ez loader)...
Sure it could. Very easily. But I suspect those high pressure sol valves are a bit spendy. Then you need a five connector plug instead of four, and the truck backup circuit has to be tapped into and fed to the trailer. I think all the newer rigs with factory tow packages already have the wiring to the plug, so it would just be a matter of changing connectors on the trailer.
Another option for anyone wanting to easily lockout their brakes manually would be a manual valve inline behind the sol valve. Another simple install, but they aren't cheap either.
Perhaps I should qualify my earlier post. I have a slip in the local marina, and I only launch/retrieve a few tmes a year. If I had to back the lights under water every time I used the boat, it might not be such a hassle to me to come up with a way to disable the brakes when the lights are unplugged. My guess as to what I would do is use a four pole plug for the lights and a fifth single plug for the brakes which I leave plugged in when launching. Yeah, that would be easy. And who knows - the back up wire might even be the oddball one on the connector that is reversed male/female and could be plugged in by itself if you flop one half of the connector over. I'll try that next time I have the rig hooked up.
Hi Fred,
I leave the wiring connected but turn off my truck lights when backing down so the lights only go on when I hit the brakes. I also put LED lights on the trailer which I think will handle the water better and I hope longer. Seemed like I was always replacing the bulbs on my jon boat trailer!!!!
I also have a bolt for the surge breaks as backup should any of the wiring become faulty.
Hope all is well.
Crazy John Frazey
I leave the wiring connected but turn off my truck lights when backing down so the lights only go on when I hit the brakes. I also put LED lights on the trailer which I think will handle the water better and I hope longer. Seemed like I was always replacing the bulbs on my jon boat trailer!!!!
I also have a bolt for the surge breaks as backup should any of the wiring become faulty.
Hope all is well.
Crazy John Frazey
starcrafttom
Active member
I just wired the back up light wire as the outside wire on the plug. then you just turn one plug 180 degrees to the side so only the back up light is pluged in to the trailer. really simple and easy.
starcrafttom":36t3v3zy said:
Did you have to change the wiring to the plug to get it to the outside? Son, you're a young man, so you probably don't know about the old days when every rig and every trailer was wired differently and a guy had to figure it out each time he hitched something up. Things are finally pretty much standardized nowadays, so I would hate to change something on my truck, or even an adapter. Of course back in those days, we didn't worry so much about the brake circuit because everything was up hill. Both ways. But the dirt for dinner tasted OK the way mom fixed it.
Anita Marie
New member
Thanks for all the help. This problem came up as I was trying to move my boat with my camper on and my boat on a three foot extention off of my reciever. It is a three point hitch extension to take the tongue weight. I could not back the boat into the driveway because of this problem. I am going to make an extention of the wiring so I can tow/back the boat up with the camper on. It would seem that Mikes idea about a valve in the line to prevent the brakes from engaging is the most elegant way around this problem.
Thanks
Fred
Thanks
Fred
Jon - CLou
New member
Luna C is right on the money. This way works fine for us but there is one other thing to remember.
Fred, we have the same truck and I really had a head scratcher about two years ago. While backing or rolling downhill with everything plugged in, my brakes would lock up on the trailer. It took me a week to figure this one out.
At first I thought it was the solenoid or the brakes but it wasn't. It was a bad switch on the truck for the reverse back up lights. And what really drove me nuts, it was an intermittent problem. So, make sure when you put it in reverse the backup lights come on and stay on.
Fred, we have the same truck and I really had a head scratcher about two years ago. While backing or rolling downhill with everything plugged in, my brakes would lock up on the trailer. It took me a week to figure this one out.
At first I thought it was the solenoid or the brakes but it wasn't. It was a bad switch on the truck for the reverse back up lights. And what really drove me nuts, it was an intermittent problem. So, make sure when you put it in reverse the backup lights come on and stay on.
Fred-
You'll have to bleed the lines after you install the valve, plus get all the threads to fit, etc. The biggest disadvantage of the valve is that it will have to be activated by hand each time you want to back up, an inconvenience, at least, and in an emergency, a real problem.
When I replaced the drum brakes with disks on my trailer last year, I also replaced the actuator (required) and added the back up solenoid lock out. The lock out is only about $35 at Cabelas or Champion Trailers, and the wiring is not difficult at all unless you don't have a factory tow package and have to wire it from the back up lights. Still would be very easy. My two Rupples (sp.)? Joe.
You'll have to bleed the lines after you install the valve, plus get all the threads to fit, etc. The biggest disadvantage of the valve is that it will have to be activated by hand each time you want to back up, an inconvenience, at least, and in an emergency, a real problem.
When I replaced the drum brakes with disks on my trailer last year, I also replaced the actuator (required) and added the back up solenoid lock out. The lock out is only about $35 at Cabelas or Champion Trailers, and the wiring is not difficult at all unless you don't have a factory tow package and have to wire it from the back up lights. Still would be very easy. My two Rupples (sp.)? Joe.
starcrafttom
Active member
I had a really problem when i first got my trailer. my rig is a 94 ranger. it comes with a tow package with a 4 prong plug. I bought a 5 prong plug and the instruction said to wire the parking light wire to the parking light and the back up light. Well that did not work because the 94ranger is a mazda. So the back up lights are not on the same circuit as the parking lights. So i wired the four wires coming out from the stock plug to the 5 way connector and then traced down the back up light ( thanks dad for teaching me wiring diagrams) and hooked that up to the last plug. If you want to unplug your lights and still back up just off set the plugs, male and female ends, so only the back up light prongs are hooked up. But to tell you the truth with the sealed lights and the new lid bulbs why would you have to unplug them? thats a really old guy thing and Iam only forty this nov.
I have a new Pacific Trailer with disc brakes which have an extra wire in the harness that connects to the backup lights on the tow vehicle. When in reverse it locks out the brakes, preventing them from locking up. With the light plug out, you must do this manually by moving the lever on the trailer hitch to the back up position. A length of wire, wrapped around the lever and the end of a nearby bolt will prevent it from slipping back into the trailering position while you manuever.
Thanks Sealife Mike. I ran out and found the same little knurled knob/lever on my Pacific trailer w/disc brakes. Doubt if I'd use it since, like a number of Brats, I don't bother to unplug when launching or recovering, but it's nice to know should one need to move it around using a front mount receiver.
BTW, Pacific has switched over to all LED lighting now and the new LED lights are interchangeable with the old ones, albeit spendy. No, I don't have the new type (yet) but visited their Chino facility last week for some warranty work and noticed the new parts.
One problem I do have is the fact that no matter how tight I make the transom tiedowns, the boat's stern still slides back and forth on turns. Stops when the bunker hits the outer strake, of course, but it is a tad disconcerting. Any hints? Or is this the usual C-Dory behavior?
Don
BTW, Pacific has switched over to all LED lighting now and the new LED lights are interchangeable with the old ones, albeit spendy. No, I don't have the new type (yet) but visited their Chino facility last week for some warranty work and noticed the new parts.
One problem I do have is the fact that no matter how tight I make the transom tiedowns, the boat's stern still slides back and forth on turns. Stops when the bunker hits the outer strake, of course, but it is a tad disconcerting. Any hints? Or is this the usual C-Dory behavior?
Don
In typical C-Brat style, this discussion started with one subject, resolved it, and moved onto another. Also in typical style, the second topic is, and will be in the future, valuable in its own right. So, the discussion following Sneaks' last observation and question has been split off into its own topic, Securing Boat On Trailer.