Buying new batteries
- Thread starter BRBKEN
- Start date
We use Sam's club series 27, ( 107 amp hr) One of my batteries is 2 years old the other 3 years old .Both seem to be in good condition . We use the battery switch number 1 going out and number 2 coming back from a long cruise seems to work well . I very rarely hook up to the battery charger . I only hook up when boat is home for maintenance or repairs or when at a marina over nighting .
colbysmith
Active member
Several years ago I purchased marine batteries from either Walmart or Farm and Fleet. Basic marine Lead Acids. I've read so many reports on the other various types of batteries, but in the end just seemed like the most cost efficient batteries for our use on Midnight Flyer came back to the standard Lead Acid type marine batteries. I have two batteries with a switch that allows me to select battery 1, 2, both or off. I use 1 for my house battery and 2 for my starting battery. My MasterVolt Charger charges both batteries at the same time regardless of switch position. When the outboard is charging the batteries, I tend to start with starter battery, then switch to both to charge the batteries up while running. Often I'll charge just 2, then switch to battery 1 to bring it up. Then switch back to battery 2 until using the house battery over night. I believe the sizes are 24 and 27. (Larger one for the house.) I got at least 6-7 years on the new Sears Die Hards that were placed in the boat just before I bought it. Probably would have lasted several more years, but I wanted new batteries before my trip to Alaska.
BRBKEN":3bp5gfnj said:
I don't know about these days, but 20 years back Exide & Gould produced all the lead acid battery's. You buy enough & they will put whatever name on them you want. :wink:
I have 2 Group 31's in parallel for the house & 2 Group 24's in parallel for starting with the old fashioned 1, 2, ALL & off switch.
I get 5-6 yrs then replace out of paranoia.
Y M M V :thup
I have had my boat for 15 years and have replaced the batteries twice. Both times with Interstate Marine/RV 98 amp hours, they are Group 29, the largest physical size I can get into the lazarettes. I do have an onboard Guest 10amp 5/5 charger, but rarely use that. When in the barn at home, I put each battery onto a "BatteryMinder" charger that monitors the state of charge and varies according to the battery state. The BatteryMinder's have a desulfating phase that gets run every 30 cycles or so. I have replaced the batteries at 7 years, with them still at 90+%. The BatteryMinder (specific brand name) are an investment in battery life that has paid off several times over. I now keep them on the motorcycle and truck or car when they are not running frequently.
I do have a "1-2-Both-Off" switch, and it is generally in the "Both" switch. I do monitor my battery DC voltage very (extremely) often, (ask Andy on Osprey or Jeff on Ripple). The system works for me, and so far, (knock on my head -- since it is the closest real wood around), no electrical fails.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
I do have a "1-2-Both-Off" switch, and it is generally in the "Both" switch. I do monitor my battery DC voltage very (extremely) often, (ask Andy on Osprey or Jeff on Ripple). The system works for me, and so far, (knock on my head -- since it is the closest real wood around), no electrical fails.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
Interstate are good (came with my boat and holding up well), Odyssey batteries are good are good. I have been using Sam's Club AGM Group 31 Duracell for over 10 years and these are what I will go to when the Interstates give out. These are made by East Penn (same a Deka). The major manufactures are Carlos (was Johnson Controls) (#1), Deka, Interstate, Exide, and a host of smaller companies.
My LIFePO4 batteries are by Battle Born.
It is not the brand of battery which gives the reliability, but how they are used and treated.
Ideally you would have a separate house and engine start, of the same type, age and capacity. You would have more than you need for either. You would NEVER discharge a battery to more than 50% State Of Charge (SOC). That is 12.2 volts resting state (for one hour after charging or any load).
You would have a battery monitoring system. I like Victron, but Balmar, Xantrex and a hand full of other companies make them. I prefer a shunt model which gives amps used and charged back into the battery.
You want a good battery charger. The ones which come with the boat are OK for topping off the battery when you get back home--and that should always be done. But if you are a serious cruiser and run your batteries down much, then a better charger is in store. I use a NOCO 30 amp for the house/engine start, and a 80 amp Victron (on the 2000 watt inverter) for the LI batteries.
Good names also include ProMariner, ProNautic series; Sterling, Blue Seas, Mastervolt.Victron and NOCO "Genius" series.
Do not wire your electronics to the engine start battery, the start up loads and spikes can shorten their lives. Best to use an automatic charging relay between the start and house batteries. Electronics off the house, and they will only charge after the engine is started and the engine start battery has begun to charge.
My LIFePO4 batteries are by Battle Born.
It is not the brand of battery which gives the reliability, but how they are used and treated.
Ideally you would have a separate house and engine start, of the same type, age and capacity. You would have more than you need for either. You would NEVER discharge a battery to more than 50% State Of Charge (SOC). That is 12.2 volts resting state (for one hour after charging or any load).
You would have a battery monitoring system. I like Victron, but Balmar, Xantrex and a hand full of other companies make them. I prefer a shunt model which gives amps used and charged back into the battery.
You want a good battery charger. The ones which come with the boat are OK for topping off the battery when you get back home--and that should always be done. But if you are a serious cruiser and run your batteries down much, then a better charger is in store. I use a NOCO 30 amp for the house/engine start, and a 80 amp Victron (on the 2000 watt inverter) for the LI batteries.
Good names also include ProMariner, ProNautic series; Sterling, Blue Seas, Mastervolt.Victron and NOCO "Genius" series.
Do not wire your electronics to the engine start battery, the start up loads and spikes can shorten their lives. Best to use an automatic charging relay between the start and house batteries. Electronics off the house, and they will only charge after the engine is started and the engine start battery has begun to charge.
cmetzenberg
New member
I'm happy with my vatozone superstart AGMs for the engines and my Costco huge green lead acid rv monstrocity for house load. FYI costco now sells AGM. You have to go in and see what they have sine everything on their website is based off of what fits in your vehicle.
gulfcoast john
New member
I bought three Group 31 Northstar AGM’s 3 years ago with a non-declining 3 year warranty. Claims over 900 discharges to 50%, but $440 each. Each exceeded its’ load test this year at annual engine service. Blue Seas P12 40 amp charger. Victron 702 on the House battery and a Blue Seas voltmeter (4 digit accuracy) on the helm bus.
The House battery does all the heavy lifting (fridge, windlass, stereo, all helm electronics etc) while the two Engine Start batteries work for about 1-2 seconds and their work day is OVER. Every cruising day, they’re each done and having a beer or two before we cast off lines in the morning. Each season I swap/change an engine Start battery to the dreaded House slot. Boy, do they whine and snivel and caterwaul when I do that, but they all last longer that way.
I am undecided on whether these AGM’s are worth over a Boat Unit, especially because a ‘switchcraft’ error could ruin one, then I’d need to replace all three (two in your case but same principle). The regime of cheaper Sam’s flooded $92 batteries, replaced every 3 years regardless, probably gives more bang (and power) for the buck. A switchcraft error would cost under $300 max. I’m likely to go that route when the time comes.
Bob’s experiment with Battle Born lithium might well prove the most cost-effective in the long run (and lower weight) despite the eye-popping initial cost...about a Boat Unit...Each.
Good luck!
John
The House battery does all the heavy lifting (fridge, windlass, stereo, all helm electronics etc) while the two Engine Start batteries work for about 1-2 seconds and their work day is OVER. Every cruising day, they’re each done and having a beer or two before we cast off lines in the morning. Each season I swap/change an engine Start battery to the dreaded House slot. Boy, do they whine and snivel and caterwaul when I do that, but they all last longer that way.
I am undecided on whether these AGM’s are worth over a Boat Unit, especially because a ‘switchcraft’ error could ruin one, then I’d need to replace all three (two in your case but same principle). The regime of cheaper Sam’s flooded $92 batteries, replaced every 3 years regardless, probably gives more bang (and power) for the buck. A switchcraft error would cost under $300 max. I’m likely to go that route when the time comes.
Bob’s experiment with Battle Born lithium might well prove the most cost-effective in the long run (and lower weight) despite the eye-popping initial cost...about a Boat Unit...Each.
Good luck!
John
John Said:
John, Bob is not just on an experiment. A couple of seasons ago I went to the Seattle Boat Show and attended a lecture done by the CEO and electrical engineer, from Pacific Yacht in Vancouver BC. His talk was on battery use, and his premise was that the Lithium (Iron) I think, were the batteries to get for the most amp hours per $$, most charge cycles per battery, and longest life of the battery -- provided they are maintained according to their required profiles -- and they do make sense. Yes, they are $$$$ per battery, but where it counts, $$ per amp hour of battery life, they turn out to be the cheapest -- ah make that lest expensive -- batteries you can put on your boat.
I was seriously interested until I started looking at the correlating required equipment. A battery to battery charger, a high end on board battery charger and a good monitoring system. The weight of the LiIon Battery weights are very appealing, the battery life is very appealing, the battery life is very appealing, BUT the space and weights of the required accessory equipment ruled them out for me.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
John, Bob is not just on an experiment. A couple of seasons ago I went to the Seattle Boat Show and attended a lecture done by the CEO and electrical engineer, from Pacific Yacht in Vancouver BC. His talk was on battery use, and his premise was that the Lithium (Iron) I think, were the batteries to get for the most amp hours per $$, most charge cycles per battery, and longest life of the battery -- provided they are maintained according to their required profiles -- and they do make sense. Yes, they are $$$$ per battery, but where it counts, $$ per amp hour of battery life, they turn out to be the cheapest -- ah make that lest expensive -- batteries you can put on your boat.
I was seriously interested until I started looking at the correlating required equipment. A battery to battery charger, a high end on board battery charger and a good monitoring system. The weight of the LiIon Battery weights are very appealing, the battery life is very appealing, the battery life is very appealing, BUT the space and weights of the required accessory equipment ruled them out for me.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
Dr Bob nailed it!
I too have had very good luck with Absorbed Glass Mat (AGM) marine batteries from Sam's (Duracell?) I especially like AGM for price, mounting options (any angle but upside down) and long term cleanliness (no acid buildup).
I am also an RC airplane fan and still a little hesitant on Lithium batteries, especially LiPo. I had a battery practically explode in my garage while charging and I could not stop the inferno. The fire was on a fireproof surface so there was a no collateral damage, but if LiPo batteries were cheaper I might consider using them for 4th of July fireworks.....not. Once they start burning you become simply a bystander. When I was in the RV business we considered converting our motor coaches to Lithium batteries but when a competitor lost a 2 million dollar coach to a Lithium battery fire I discontinued testing.
I too have had very good luck with Absorbed Glass Mat (AGM) marine batteries from Sam's (Duracell?) I especially like AGM for price, mounting options (any angle but upside down) and long term cleanliness (no acid buildup).
I am also an RC airplane fan and still a little hesitant on Lithium batteries, especially LiPo. I had a battery practically explode in my garage while charging and I could not stop the inferno. The fire was on a fireproof surface so there was a no collateral damage, but if LiPo batteries were cheaper I might consider using them for 4th of July fireworks.....not. Once they start burning you become simply a bystander. When I was in the RV business we considered converting our motor coaches to Lithium batteries but when a competitor lost a 2 million dollar coach to a Lithium battery fire I discontinued testing.
There are many different types of Li batteries. The LiFePO4 we are using are the safest. Any battery or use of electricity can be dangerous. But there are now RV's from the factories, as well as hundreds if not thousands of boats which have used the LIFePO4 technology safely. We choose Battle Born, because of the robust construction in comparison to some other batteries. Plus they are assembled in USA (almost all of the individual cells are made in China, perhaps some in other SE Asian countries.) There are some batteries being"Made" in the US--not sure how much of the component is shipped in...