Can I tow a 22 Cruiser with a 21 Ft Diesel Sprinter RV

B

browntdb

New member
I am trying to consolidate my towing and RV needs in one vehicle. I am looking to buy a used CD 22 Cruiser, and also a Leisure Travel 21 Ft. Sprinter Free Spirit RV. It is a Mercedes diesel-powered RV. It has a 4000 towing capacity.

I would really like to use the RV to tow the CD-22 without having to purchase a truck to tow it.

Here are my towing requirements: I live in Oregon and would tow the CD up I-5 to Anderson Island in Puget sound where I have a vacation home. I would store the CD at that location. Once the CD is on Anderson island, the only towing I would need would be to take it to the marina on the island and launch it and retrieve it.

I would appreciate any input you C-Brats might have for me.

Thanks,

Terry
 
Terry,

There will be lots of opinions on this so just because I am here first does not mean my answer is best, right, or special. However, I have been looking at the same vehicle for some of the same reasons. Here is what I found. The Mercedes is a 5 cylinder, and generally in the Sprinter RV set up they are auto transmission. The weight limit is kind of at or just below the real tow weight of a 22, although you may be able to get it to that, it would be pretty stripped. The typical 22 on a trailer would be closer to 4500 would be my guess.

My choice was to find a Sprinter with a Cummins 6 and a standard tranny. I think that would be a better tow vehicle. I don't know if a Banks kit on the Mercedes would get it up to where it would do the job or not, but i know a Cummins 6 can do the work (based on towing with as Dodge 3/4T PU with a standard trans.) and get respectable mileage.

I have looked at several of the Sprinter types and really like the size, mpg and drive but just would be pretty likely to figure they would be literally pushed to the max for extended towing. Now to put this into perspective. I first towed my boat home and to the mechanics with a 96 Tacoma. Now that was a big stretch in the over load neighborhood. yes it could do the tow, but stopping could be scary, turning iffy, and towing could cause hypertension and a stroke :roll: :wink:

Sure like your choice of RV's though.

Harvey
SleepyC :moon
 
I'm assuming this is a one-time trip. 4000lbs is pretty slim for a 22 with trailer. If you emptied everything out of the boat it'd still be risky as you climb some of the hills on I5. I guess I'd recommend you rent a stronger tow vehicle for that trip or, if you have a friend with a truck [V8] bribe them to pull the boat. If you opt to try it I'd drive in cool weather, go slow, take frequent rests for the transmission. Be patient. And, make sure the trailer is in good shape.
 
If you haven't bought the Class B yet, be sure to check the specific vehicle towing capacity. We had a Leisure Travel Class B on a Dodge one ton chassis and looked at the Sprinter when LT first offered them. The early models had 3,500 pound towing capacity. As I recall, these were later offered with a 5,000 pound towing capacity, but not sure of the tongue weight rating. I'm not aware of any physical changes that were made to the chassis, so it may be a hitch change or simply a paperwork change.

Folks I've talked to who own Sprinter chassis Class Bs really like 'em. We were delighted with the build quality and support from Leisure Travel.

Before we took delivery of Wild Blue, I thought a Class B towing a C-Dory would be ideal; we hauled a small sailboat all over with our Leisure Travel. The tow rating on the one we had was 8,400 pounds, though. After discussing actual weights with other CD-25 owners, we decided the LT was too close for towing capacity for that boat. After towing many thousands of miles with our GMC w/Duramax, I am convinced that we made the right decision.

We do miss the convenience of that campervan, though.

Good luck with your decisions.

Jim B.
 
I too looked at the Sprinters. We owned one for our business which had the turbo charged 5 cylinder Mercedes. Good vehicle, good mileage, but not a good tow vehicle IMHO. It's like the drunk girl at the party, you could; but I wouldn't as it could have a bad ending. Since Chevy I think puts Duramax diesels with the Allison 6 speed auto trans in three quarter and one ton vans, maybe RV on that platform might be a better possibility. We also are very happy with our Duramax powered truck. We have not seen the need to change anything from the way the factory built it. Good luck in your search.
D.D.
 
I keep my 2006 C Dory22 as light as possible for towing due to a single axle trailer. I do have a couple of Fortress anchors, and some rode, a few supplies and minimal water and fuel. The boat on the trailer comes in at 4500 lbs. I take off all canned food, the main 14# Delta anchor, outboard for the dinghy, the dinghy, ice chest or freezer. I think it would be very difficult to get a C Dory 22 on a decent trailer less than 4000 lbs.

I choose a Yukon XL to tow the C Dory--I had towed it with a Honda Pilot, which is also a marginal vehicle-(rated 3500 lbs for "house trailer" and 4500 lbs for a boat (I believe that the idea being that the boat would have less wind resistance, and probably less tongue weight. We also towed a C Dory 25 with a 30 foot RV (V 10 gas)--which had a tow rating of 5,000 lbs. To tow the 25, we up in an upgraded transmission, and beefed up both the aft frame of the RV and had a hitch shop put in a hitch (welded to the frame) which would handle 8,000 lbs. No problems with this rig, but extensive modification.

I also like the Sprint concept. We owned a RoadTrek, rated to tow 6800 lbs (Dodge V 8 small block)--but I would not consider towing that much. My wife was not happy with the amount of room in a Class B RV--I was fine with it--so if one party is not happy with the boat or RV--not as good a choice.
 
Terry,

One more factor to consider....the launch ramps you will experience, the grades and whether wet or dry.

As Wild Blue, I tow with a Duramax which gives me all I need to tow with confidence.

Mike
Kestrel
 
Have you considered a diesel truck and truck camper? Plenty of flexibility with that arrangement. Just get a good quality camper. If I were to buy another camper, it would be either a Bigfoot or Northern Lite. The fiberglass shells/roof are less prone to leaks.
 
Thanks for all the input. I think you have convinced me that the safety factor of having a good 3/4 ton diesel pickup is what I really need to haul a CD. One determining factor that I had not considered as completely as I should have was not only launching and ramp angle, etc, but on Anderson Island at the Riviera Community marina where I would want to launch from most of the time, the grade down to the water is very steep and winding. I doubt that a Sprinter with the boat behind it would be able to get back up that really steep grade. A diesel pickup with a manual trans. would have no problem at all.

For not having a CD, yet, this site has been a remarkable resource for me. I have been able to make some very well informed decisions regarding type of CD and many other things because all of you have been so willing to offer your advice to me. I can see that once we own a CD this site will continue to be a valuable resource and a place where perhaps I can share my experiences after having a CD for a few years with other newbies.

Terry
 
browntdb":hij1t5xo said:
Thanks for all the input. I think you have convinced me that the safety factor of having a good 3/4 ton diesel pickup is what I really need to haul a CD.
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browntdb":hij1t5xo said:
Here are my towing requirements: I live in Oregon and would tow the CD up I-5 to Anderson Island in Puget sound where I have a vacation home. I would store the CD at that location. Once the CD is on Anderson island, the only towing I would need would be to take it to the marina on the island and launch it and retrieve it.
Click to expand...

I'll offer a slightly different opinion. I'm just thinking that it sounds like 99% of your Class B use would be just traveling, for which it would be fantastic; and around 1% of it would be towing to your local ramp. And a Class B would be so nice for that 99%.

I have towed a CD-22 type boat with a 1-ton, dually pickup truck and I'll have to say it came the closest to "hardly know it was back there" of any combo I have towed. That said, the truck is rated to tow something like 15,000#, so it's really no surprise that it handled <5,000# with aplomb. More is always better in a tow vehicle, but for various reasons I wouldn't always opt for it.

It sounds like you don't plan to tow your CD-22 "any distance" on a regular basis, right? Just once to get to your northern home and then occasionally down to the local launch ramp? Not that you want to do that with a VW Bug, but that scenario seems a lot different to me than something like regular cross-country towing. I would be more comfortable using a vehicle that was near/at its limit for those very short tows than for cross-country/regular towing. So maybe there is something to the idea of renting or borrowing a larger truck for the one trip north, and then using a Sprinter (you mention 5-cylinder, but are there newer 6-cylinder models? What about the 3500 dually Sprinter?) - or maybe an older pickup truck for your local to-the-ramp towing. For that I don't see why an older/gas truck would be any problem.

Another possible route: I bought a used 3/4-ton gasoline-engined camper van for towing my 22. It has a 13,000# GCWR and weighed in at around 7400# loaded for my trip (sans boat), so I'm not at the rating but neither do I have many thousands of pounds to spare. On the other hand, I have a heavy vehicle with a nice, long wheelbase and many of the same goodies that the same van with larger engines(s) and higher GCWR's have. I towed my 22 from Florida to Washington state earlier this summer and, while I knew I was towing, and it's not the Ultimate tow vehicle, I found it more than satisfactory, and I really enjoyed/used the Class B camper van capabilities of it. So maybe that's another option.

(Of course if you just *want* a large, diesel pickup and/or you wouldn't feel comfortable with something else, then that's a different thing; I'm just saying that in the grand scheme of towing things, around ~5,000# is not a huge load, and it can be managed with less-than-ultimate tow vehicles.)

Two things I found to be very good:

1) A longer wheelbase (for example my van has a wheelbase of something around 138", IIRC; whereas some of the "just barely 5,000# tow rated vehicles," such as the Highlander or Pilot, had wheelbases more around 109", again going by memory. I think they would be more "squirrelly" on long freeway tows. I would likely use one for a two-block tow though, if they could handle the ramp (maybe 4WD would take care of that?).

2) Good trailer brakes. I have a tandem axle trailer and put new, high-quality disc brakes on all four wheels before leaving on my first trip. I think the van stops better with the trailer than without it now - very nice. (Mine are just surge brakes, btw.)

Again, I won't say my van tows as "unnoticeably" as the 1-ton dually pickup does, but then that could be bested by a Mack truck, I'm sure :mrgreen: Since you are not going to be towing any distance but for the first time, I think you may have other options if you wish to consider them.

Oh, one more thing, which I only touched on above: I haven't done much launching/retrieving with my combo - at the moment the vast majority of my experience is just with highway towing. It's possible that I will find I need/want 4WD for launching/retrieving, in which case I'll change vehicles. But that would be about the traction on the ramp, not towing qualities.

Sunbeam

PS: Of course gas doesn't get as good a mileage as diesel. In my case the whole vehicle was so much less expensive (and I didn't want a diesel/noise right "in the van with me" the way van engines sit) that the cost was still quite a bit less. I get 16mpg highway when not towing (up to 18 if I keep it to 60mph or less), and around 12-13 on just "in town" driving. That changes to around 12-13 average when (highway) towing. I'm sure a diesel would do better.

PPS: Note that some folks are speaking of CD-25's, which are more like 8500#+ all-up vs. the 5,000#+ of the 22.
 
Nice analysis Sunbeam. One of the things you mentioned and one that I have considered is that I might just get an inexpensive older 3/4 ton 4x4 and leave it on the island to launch my boat.

I have some other considerations regarding other vehicles and trading/selling that needs to happen before making the final decision.

Terry
 
The 07 and newer rigs are v6. They have a bit more torque.
I have a 24' motor home on a Sprinter chassis and have been contemplating the same thing.
I now tow a 3500#Honda with no problem.
Jerry
 
One weak spot that is common with lot of vehicles used to tow boats and RV's is the transmission. Going with a Duramax means the engine gets matched with a equally good transmission the Allision six speed. When you start to add up a trip to the transmission shop along with mpg figures between 6 or 8 mpg and gas at 4 to 5 dollars a gallon you might want to stay pretty close to your front porch. At 35,000 miles averaging 15 mpg means we spent more than $9300 dollars in fuel if my calcaulations are right. If you are getting 8 MPG that same 35,000 miles cost you 17,500. Both gas and diesel figured at 4.00 per gallon. A new 4x4 Toyota Tundra 08/09 I think was about 28 to 30 k. Our truck an 09 new was 44k. We have a 100k bumper to bumper warranty. Over the course 100,000 miles the ecomomy starts to show. Everyone's different but for us our choice of a 3/4 ton diesel 4x4 pickup provides us with a lot of options. If we decide to get a bigger boat we don't need to go out shopping for another tow vehicle. If we want to park the boat and pull a decent sized Rv trailer we are still pretty well set for the tow vehicle. Towing with a vehicle that is a joy to drive and comfortable opens you up to a lot of possible destinations. If your needs are just to launch than a 1/2 or 3/4 ton rust bucket is the answer. I know my wife would veto parking a piece like that in our driveway. :roll: Good Luck with your choice.
D.D.
 
Having just purchased a new Winnebago View on Sprinter chassis with the Mercedes diesel, I don't think I would attempt more than a "local" tow even though it is rated at 5000 lbs and 500 lb tongue weight.
There is simply no comparison to a Chevy Duramax/Allison (which is admittedly overkill for a CD22) in the torque or handling characteristics.
The View is however an excellent compromise for camping as it is small enough to drive around most shopping malls etc and the accomodations are superb. We returned from Eastern WA in the wind and snow yesterday and were getting up to 15 mpg except where the strong wind and uphill co-incided :-(
We were also heavily loaded with essential winter supplies of vino.
Anyone thinking of purchasing one would be well advised to join in the 3 excellent View/Navion (same beast, different badge) websites where there is a wealth of information on all past and present models from a group that is nearly as polite as this one :-)

From which you may have gathered that we have made something of a "Bill & El" type decision to do more of the land based things that we have missed while we can still remember where they are. That will mean the boat will probably be very much under-used so we may sell it and come back to something smaller, maybe even a CD :-)

Merv & Kathy
 
The only place where I would disagree slightly with Sunbeam is on the Honda Pilot (I agree that longer wheel base is better and one of the reasons we got the Yukon XL)

We towed the 22 (and even on a couple of very short tows, the 25) with the Honda Pilot on the highway, including S. Calif to Powell on several occasions, and had no problems (that boat had a tandem axle trailer and dual disc brakes). The current single axle trailer might be a bit different.

We have been pulling boat trailers for about 55 years, and the current truck is the first 4 x 4--the only reason we got the 4 x 4 was the neutral transfer case so we could tow it behind the RV. The Pilot had all wheel drive, and we have used it a couple of times on a local dirt/sand ramp with the Caracal or similar sized boats. It is rare to find a ramp where you need 4 x 4--but then if you have a bad ramp...it is very valuable. One problem with pickups is that without enough weight on the rear tires, they can slip. On one occasion when we sold a boat, we had to load the back of the new owner's pick up with people to get traction. That pickup didn't have tow hooks on the front--I would opt for tow hooks if I didn't get 4 x 4, because some one can always help pull you out.
 
thataway":1riou3cj said:
The only place where I would disagree slightly with Sunbeam is on the Honda Pilot (I agree that longer wheel base is better and one of the reasons we got the Yukon XL)
Click to expand...

And since you have actual experience towing with the Pilot, while I was only thinking out loud about wheel base lengths (which I had fresh in my mind after quite a bit of internal debate about what tow vehicle to get for myself), I would put a lot more weight on your opinion of it!

thataway":1riou3cj said:
We have been pulling boat trailers for about 55 years, and the current truck is the first 4 x 4... It is rare to find a ramp where you need 4 x 4--but then if you have a bad ramp...it is very valuable. One problem with pickups is that without enough weight on the rear tires, they can slip.
Click to expand...

It's good to hear your thoughts on 4 x 4. That's one strong reason I considered either a pickup truck or a Pilot/Sequoia, etc. Ultimately I decided to try going 2 x 4 -- at least initially -- because I really wanted the camper van features. While it sounds like 4 x 4 would be a nice thing to have, it sounds like maybe I'll be able to get by satisfactorily without it. (The Pilot was really tempting though! Especially combined with "boateling" on the road.)

I guess what I was really trying to say, in a nutshell (but I rarely type a nutshell :wink:), is that there may be other satisfactory options (in addition to the suggested 3/4-ton diesel pickup), for the OP's specific scenario as I read it (99% camping/traveling without the boat, one longer tow, and then just towing to the local ramp and back with a ~5,000# load).

Sunbeam
 
We bought a 2006 Winnebago View this year with the Mercedes 5 cylinder. We have not towed the CD22 yet, but we did travel for 7 weeks through the Colorado rockies and the Canadian Rockies with no concerns of power at all (17,000 miles since March). There is no doubt that it will tow our CD22. Already added the transmission cooler and have other mods ready for next year.

I plan to redo the frame extension on the View next year and tow the CD22 (w/o fuel, water, and bare). I WILL do it, just a matter of what I need to do to get it done (brakes, etc).

As much as we love our CD22, we love the View. Can't wait to have both with us.
 
I will put it simply - you're nuts......Towing a 5000 pound trailer with a good deal of frontage with a minature 5 cylinder diesel and being happy with its performance is really optimistic.

I even think once or twice about pulling my CD 22 behind my V10 E450 25 foot winnebago - and that is a LOT more chassis. It is only marginal in the mountains with a lot of 40 mph hills.

If you end up doing a lot of towing with that setup you will probably be very sorry you got it.
 
Wow, do I like this thread. Learning a lot. Have been thinking of going there. I do like the View, but not the power or tow rating. Wonder if Banks Accessories would do anything to help out the Mercedes 5 cyl. with more power?

Harvey
SleepyC :moon
 
Consider that the Mercedes engines are already getting a lot of HP and Torque out of a small block! Bank's or other accessories might void any warrantee and probably not do much for this engine. There are always better exhaust flow, air intake and a re-chipping.(the latter most likely to void warrantee) It is only a 3 Liter engine. The pickup engines are about twice this displacement! The Duramax is 6 liters, the Cummins B series is 5.9 liters, Ford's is 6.4liters! (The old Navistar was a 7.3 Liter engine)

The older 5 cyl Sprinter engine (2.7Liter) got a little better fuel economy, but apparently there was some EPA issue with it.
 
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