Crazy Washington Tides?

J

joefish

New member
I thought I understood tides pretty well. For years I've paid close attention to tides for fishing and almost always know the tide predictions before I launch a boat. But when I started checking out www.saltwatertides.com for Washington State, Admiralty Inlet, Marrowstone Point, December 5th it did not seem to make sense.

Water height at low tide: 0.8 ft
high tide: 9.4 ft
next low tide: 4.6 ft
next high tide: 5.8 ft

How can there possibly be such extreme differences in hi and low tides in the same day!?!

:shock:
 
Not a problem and not unusual. The tides for the 5th are in between the full and new moon. Look at the full moon tides, same area, Port Townsend:
12th at 8:56PM -3.0 Low
13th at 5:12AM 9.4 High = + 12.4
13th at 9:17AM 6.9 Low = - 2.5
13th at 2:31PM 9.3 High = + 2.4
13th at 9:42PM -3.2 Low = - 12.5

These are pretty common tides here. 6,8,10 ft variations and sometimes down to 2 or 4. Makes some approaches time sensitive. There are places on the coast where 15 to 20 foot tides are the norm. And there are places where tidal changes cause currents that run in the 5 - 8 knot bracket. There are some that are higher than that. (Skookumchuk Rapids up on the BC coast for example). Juan de Fuca Strait often has 3 - 5 knot current running at max flow times.

Hey, it's good you are doing your home work. Don't let the tide changes get to you. What you want to be aware of is the "tide rips" where opposing tides come together around a point of land. Marrowstone Point, or Point Wilson, both close to Port Townsend, are good examples. Cattle Point, which is one of the main entrances to the San Juan Islands from the south off the Strait of Juan, is another fine example of a rip to watch for.

All of these are negotiable, by watching the current direction, the time, and the rips. All of the rips are stronger in some areas than others, and being fluid, changes occur during the flow change, so keeping a good eye out, some local knowledge, and good boat handling skills will get you through. Patience and planning are both essential.

Harvey
SleepyC:moon

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It's all part of the fun of boating here. The tides can produce a lot of skinny water in places that inexperienced or careless boaters aren't looking for. Those charts are important, and MINUS tides happen - sometimes a zero sounding on a chart can be 3 or even 4 feet high and dry at an extreme tide. But our kinds of boats are well suited to dealing with skinny water as well as the strong currents the big tides and narrow channels can produce. Sometimes it can even be a challenge to figure out which direction the current will be going! In some places the outgoing tide is NOT moving in the same direction as the outgoing tide was the week before. (Try to find a reliable current chart for the Swinomish Channel if you want a laugh!) But again, while these challenges can deter some boats (those with deep draft, slow speed or limited maneuverability) your C-Dory will do just fine.

As Harvey says, it's good you're planning ahead. I have a friend who moved out here after many years of boating experience on Lake Michigan. His first look at a 15 foot tide swing totally freaked him out. He had anchored his sailboat in 12 feet of water at high tide.
 
Joe, better go farther Down East to the Bay of Fundy...it's easier there....

Almost any day High....... + OMG :shock:
Almost any day Low........ - DAMN WHERE'S THE WATER :roll:

:hot :moon :hot

Harder to tell the differences between one OMG and another, and when the water's gone, it just sometimes goes farther, but it's still gone.. :thup

Our other place is on Little Kennebec Bay on the Lower reaches of the Fundy tides. We've only got 17-20 feet or so. :mrgreen:


Charlie :wink:
 
Thanks for your responses. I'd also be interested in comments related to, not just the extreme tide change at the start of the day (0.8 to 9.4) but also the significant lack of tidal change during the second two tides of the day.

I know tides are more extreme at higher latitudes and with full and new moons but... How can a high tide raise the water to 9.4 ft but approximately 12 hours later, the next high tide, only raises the water to 5.8 ft.
 
joefish":1lidv24o said:
Thanks for your responses. I'd also be interested in comments related to, not just the extreme tide change at the start of the day (0.8 to 9.4) but also the significant lack of tidal change during the second two tides of the day.

I know tides are more extreme at higher latitudes and with full and new moons but... How can a high tide raise the water to 9.4 ft but approximately 12 hours later, the next high tide, only raises the water to 5.8 ft.
Click to expand...

See - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tide
 
The tides in the PNW were surprizing for me too having been born in the UK on the Bristol channel where the tide on this Dec 15th will be +36.7 ft. (Makes for a long walk home if you get the timing wrong !!)

BUT these tides were perfectly regular so easy to deal with.

The Wikipedia article is a very good explanation for the irregularities of our tides and it is definitely fun to deal with. You can make or loose a lot of fuel efficiency by taking account of tide flows and can loose a lot of teeth if you get in to even a 4 knot rip with the wind against you.

M
 
Now that you are getting to understand tides in the PNW , lets talk about current. Very often High tide is NOT slack current. We can reach hi tide a hour or more before the current stops pushing in more water. Same thing for low tide and slack currents. Some areas don't have a slack current, current just changes directions from south to south east to north east to north as the currents are moving and butting up against one another. Many channels with have back currents against the shore heading , for example, north while the water in the center of the channel is going south.

You want to buy these two books now and start to play with them washborns currents and the Canadian Hydrographic Service’s current atlas for area 5. When you get these just pick a day and look up the tides hi and low on line or in your tided book/program. Then open washburns for that day and time and it will tell you which page to start on in the current table, which are maps with arrows showing the current speed and strength. Play with that for a while and you will see the difference around the Islands for tide and current. Oh and then add in large spring run off from any number of large rivers to the mix. Good times.
 
Oh Grumpy ( hes not really) makes a good point about wind. You have to know your wind if you are planning a run some where. Not just that a 15mph wind is going to cause a 3ft swell, but that a 15mph wind AGINIST a 5 knot current will cause a 5 ft short chop that will pound you. But a hour later after the current changes direction and is now going with the wind you could have smooth water in the same 15mph blow. Or even better is you know where that back tide is a mile or so away you might be able to take a different route that will be smoother. Its three parts Tide, Current and Wind. have fun.
 
Yeah Tom. Makes me laugh when people tell me what great fuel economy they get at 5 kts. Try it with 3 Kts current on the nose and compare the answer with 15 Kts through the water :-)

(even better, try it with 5 Kts current and tell me when you get there :-))

Is it summer yet ?

M
 
Oh and that short tide between the two big tides is great for fishing ,crabbing, and shrimping. Here we fish a hour before slack current until a hour to two hours after slack as a general rule. That can change a lot depending on where you are and if you can find a back eddy some where. In the SJ's I will know before I go where I will fish thru the tides. One point is only good on the incoming until slack and then it dies and you move to a out going eddy 3 miles away at another spot.
 
Thanks starcrafttom, now we're back on focus -- When do we fish!!!
The Wikipedia article was very good and now I'm anxious to pick up Washborns.
Tides, and ultimately flow, is not as simple, but way more interesting than I once thought.

I love this site. :D :thup :thup :D
 
Run through the San Juans enough and you learn what side of a channel experiences the most tidal current, too. When driving the whale watch boats, I learned that picking the far side of a channel may actually get me through there faster than the closer side. You do the balance of fuel burn, speed, and timing to maximize the reason for the trip. It's not unusual to see sailboats waiting near a pass for the tide/current to change.

I love boating in the PNW - never a dull day. :D (And sure glad for floating docks!)

Certainly different from our typical 2 foot tides here in the Tropical Tip. (Where floating docks are a rarity.)
 
link to maps

This is a link to Johns sporting goods map page. If you are looking to learn to fish the PNW area this is as good as any place to start. Its not the only source and or even a Great source but it will get you headed in the right direction. It list many but not any where near all the fishing spots in the areas. You can also order his boat on fishing which has all of these maps plus a few more. Also sign up for his monthly news letter. This will get you or anyone started.

P.S. I can only use johns site in google chrome but others dont have that problem.
 
If you want to know what the currents are doing in a particular area, go here.

If you want to learn about fishing for salmon, halibut, shrimp or crab in Puget Sound, read this.

If you want a source of great information relevant to fishing the salt in the Pacific Northwest, go here.
 
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