Disc breaks vs Drum breaks

J

john211880

New member
What do you guys think about the merit of disc vs drum breaks on your trailer? Which one will not work in reverse? My ideal set would be electric over hydraulic with an inertial brake controller in the cab. What is the downside to this set-up?

John
 
My surge coupler has a connection to the backup lights. When the lights
go on, a solenoid trips and prevents the brakes from engaging. As
far as I know, this would work for either drum or disk.

Disk should be easier to wash and maintain. I was under the impression
that the rotors are stainless. But, I guess not in all cases since mine
have surface rust on them.

Mike
 
John-

Discs work equally well in forward or reverse, and require a back up light activated solenoid or mechanical lock out to back up easily.

Drum brakes are self-energizing the way the shoe is pulled into the drum once activated in forward travel, and you can back up w/o the lockout in the opposite direction. The lack of a self-energizing effect in disc brakes is why they require higher pedal pressures and usually need power assisted brakes in cars and trucks.

Mike's right on about the ease of clean up and flushing of discs. They also dry better, reducing rust.

Discs do drag more, with zero clearance between the "resting" pad and the disc. But you CAN easily see how much brake lining is left with a disc system, whereas the drum has to be removed to see the drum shoes. Some disc drag helps heat up the discs on short drives to dry out the system after flushing. Better to flush out at the top of the ramp and then drive home, drying out the brakes, than flush at home later and then let the system sit and rust!

For salt water use, discs are much better for their ease of flushing and drying out, especially if they are made with stainless rotors and other non-corrosive parts (some parts will be brass or other non-corossive metals as they can be made cheaper (less expensive metals/easier to machine) and are just as serviceable in some parts applications).

I love the electric over hydraulic concept, the only disadvantage being the cost. If I remember correctly, dual axle Kodiak stainless disc brakes with electric over hydraulic brakes and all the goodies, including the break-away battery to power the trailer brakes after a separation, was abut $2500.

C-Bill, who has a CD-22 and lives in Carson City, Nevada, has a very slick set up like we're talking about on his trailer. You might email or PM him for more information.

Joe.
 
Sea Wolf":2s2byjw3 said:
John-
...
Drum brakes are self-energizing the way the shoe is pulled into the drum once activated in forward travel, and you can back up w/o the lockout in the opposite direction. The lack of a self-energizing effect in disc brakes is why they require higher pedal pressures and usually need power assisted brakes in cars and trucks.

...
Joe.
Click to expand...

If you backed uphill, wouldn't you need a lockout, disk or drum?

Mike
 
mikeporterinmd":6ygvxfr3 said:
Sea Wolf":6ygvxfr3 said:
John-
...
Drum brakes are self-energizing the way the shoe is pulled into the drum once activated in forward travel, and you can back up w/o the lockout in the opposite direction. The lack of a self-energizing effect in disc brakes is why they require higher pedal pressures and usually need power assisted brakes in cars and trucks.

...
Joe.
Click to expand...

If you backed uphill, wouldn't you need a lockout, disk or drum?

Mike
Click to expand...

Yup, up a hill, or curb, or or wanted to drag race someone else with a trailer in reverse! Sorry aboaut the omission!

Funny enough, they have dirt track races here in Redding with old hopped up pickups and trailers. Never seen 'em, though! Think it might be fun to see, however.

How about a gymkana, trailers attached, with some really fun reverse sections? Can you spell "j-a-c-k-k-n-i-f-e"???

A JACKKNIFE GYMKANA...right in there with A PANGADORY PILOTHOUSE!

Joe.
 
My SA trailer is equipted with disk brakes and has a five wire plug. This locks out the brakes in reverse. I do not use this arrangement as my trailer has a special pin and a lock out hole on the surge brake coupler. when I need to back up I just get out and insert the pin. This works every time. Many times this is not needed because you are going downhill on the ramp. I just prefer the sure mechanical device over the electric connection.
 
Just a comment on the solenoid lockout device on disc brake trailers. They are just an on/off valve actuated usually by your backup lights. They do not relieve existing pressure, just stop anymore being applied. So, for example, if you pull up to your driveway and stop, thus applying your brakes, then put it in reverse to backup, the solenoid energizes but the hydraulic pressure of that forward stop is still maintained on the brakes! Thus, no backing up (if applied fairly hard). You have to go forward with a quick jerk to unload the brakes, stop gently to not re-energize, then put it in reverse.

Now, if you're backing up hill or up a driveway, try not to stop and have to pull it forward again, this will again apply brake pressure and when you put it in reverse, the brakes will still be on. The only choice at that point is to block the trailer wheels, pull forward against the stops and unload the brake pressure. Then resume backing up (while someone removes the blocks...!).

I use a mechanical stop I fabbed before backing up my driveway. I painted it bright red so I remind myself to remove it before hitting the road again. Hope this helps.
 
The actual cyliner and accentuator for conversion from surge to electric over hyrdaulic costs about $650. You will have some wiring and tubing costs if you have some one else do the conversion. Then you need the controler in the truck cab. I would say that the conversion should cost between $1000 to $1200.

You don't want an intertial controller--you want a controler activated by the brake pedal (basically a switch) and a level activated rayostat for amount of current--amount of braking applied). You want to be able to apply the brakes on the trailer only in some circumstances for safety.

I have had disc brakes on my last three trailers--much better and easier to care for than the drum brakes. I use an IR thermometer every two hours to check the temp of the rotors, the hubs and the tires. Just part of my "Walk around" and stretch the legs at stops.
 
thataway":1qpslf3r said:
The actual cyliner and accentuator for conversion from surge to electric over hyrdaulic costs about $650. You will have some wiring and tubing costs if you have some one else do the conversion. Then you need the controler in the truck cab. I would say that the conversion should cost between $1000 to $1200.

You don't want an intertial controller--you want a controler activated by the brake pedal (basically a switch) and a level activated rayostat for amount of current--amount of braking applied). You want to be able to apply the brakes on the trailer only in some circumstances for safety.

I have had disc brakes on my last three trailers--much better and easier to care for than the drum brakes. I use an IR thermometer every two hours to check the temp of the rotors, the hubs and the tires. Just part of my "Walk around" and stretch the legs at stops.
Click to expand...

I already have the controller in my truck, which I use with my travel trailer, so all I will need to do on my EZ-Loader is change the brakes themselves. What brand of disk brakes did you buy, and where?

Warren
 
Bob-

Thanks for the "correction" on the price of the system conversion. I was basing my estimate on a complete renewal of brakes on two axles with the absolute best Kodiak parts and all the new electric/hydraulic equipment for the conversion.

Joe.
 
dogon dory":3lko45ov said:
Just use a Dodge truck as a tow vehicle and you'll never go fast enough to need any brakes at all.
Click to expand...

And you are driving ... what?

Ready for a pulling challenge? Hauling Tom Cats to the top of Parley's Summit or Snoqualmie Pass?

Warren
 
I would agree with Joe as to the complete conversion of two axles with Kodiak brakes as being in the cost range of $2500.

I am susposed to have Kodiak brakes--at least that is what I ordered. However there is some rust on the discs--so I am suspicious--I will have to get under and see if I can see the brand on the brake housing.

I think that Kodiak is the best system.
 
Bob- I know that you are aware of this, but for others, to avoid confusion, we might note that Kodiak makes about four levels of brakes in different combinations of metals with the mostly stainless being the top of the line.

Here's a LINK to their products.

And a LINK to the top of the line kit (3500 lb).

Just for interest, check out the photo of their brakes being tested on the dynomometer, and the photos and information on their new CERAMIC brakes! Links at the bottom right of their Homepage.

Joe.
 
dogon dory":2u1vqbmc said:
Just use a Dodge truck as a tow vehicle and you'll never go fast enough to need any brakes at all.
Click to expand...

ROTFL

Be kind to the owners of those German vehicles. They do have the Cummins engine, after all. Kind'a reminds me of a Bayliner/Cummins equivalent on wheels....

Don
 
We should have two sets of 12" disc brakes on the TC 255. The CD 22 may be OK with the 10" discs--but I suspect it is close. Unfortunately my discs rusted after two trips into salt water--both times washed down with fresh water immediately after the boat was pulled out (hand pumped presssure washer)--so I am quite sure that the trailer manufacturer didn't put on the discs which were ordered.....
 
thataway":x7uy91dh said:
We should have two sets of 12" disc brakes on the TC 255. The CD 22 may be OK with the 10" discs--but I suspect it is close. Unfortunately my discs rusted after two trips into salt water--both times washed down with fresh water immediately after the boat was pulled out (hand pumped presssure washer)--so I am quite sure that the trailer manufacturer didn't put on the discs which were ordered.....
Click to expand...

I have two sets of 12" disc brakes on my trailer as well. The rotors look cruddy (rust?) also but I wonder how much effect that is going to have once you get going and the calipers scrape off the rust?

I checked my brake lights also. They appear to be the same LED set as West Marine is selling, complete with center bar.

I went to the EZ-Loader site and believe that these "custom welded pontoon" trailers are what C-Dory is providing for the Tom Cat.

I would like to upgrade the controller to electric, though.

Warren
 
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