Honda 90 (carb) starting tips needed

Ken O

Ken O

Member
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
135
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C Dory Year
1990
C Dory Model
22 Cruiser
Vessel Name
Ravens' Roost
I can't seem to figure out the right combination of choke and throttle when starting this engine when cold. It does start, but it often takes 5-10 seconds of cranking. Fresh non-alky gas, new plugs, wires, coils, etc. Once started it idles perfectly after a minute or so and runs great. It restarts instantly when warm. I'm familiar with manual chokes on everything from old cars and trucks to chainsaws, but I can't seem to get the feel of starting this one. Any suggestions? I'm pretty sure I'm the problem here--not the motor...[/i]
 
You could try pushing/holding the binnacle side button (while moving the throttle forward) to add throttle w/o putting motor in gear, when starting. Perhaps, the low speed idle needs adjusting.
 
OK....dumb question of the day....are you certain it even has a manual choke? Some of the newer ones have an automatic choke made of wax. Honda calls it by-starter valve or something. Just for reference, my newer yamaha has what looks like a choke control, but isn't at all - just idle and nothing more. And yeah....it has an automatic choke. I don't hate it or love it. It works. BTW no throttle at all seems to work best on those.
 
The engine is a 2007. I'm pretty sure it is a choke and not just an idle lever. The manual says it is also a choke, plus there is also a push/pull choke on the engine itself (it has the choke symbol on it).
 
Are you getting pressure at the fuel bulb? Honda's are strange in that sometimes you have to hold the bulb and face the arrow up (towards the sky) on the bulb...

That solved a lot of my "hard starting" issues.
 
I'm not at the boat right now but will check he fuel bulb next weekend. I do not have the type of remote control that allows disengaging the gear to just work the throttle. I did notice in the manual that the remote choke activates an electronic solenoid. I wonder if that is working. I'll check that also. Thanks for the thoughts.
 
Ken O":wr65e67o said:
I'm not at the boat right now but will check he fuel bulb next weekend. I do not have the type of remote control that allows disengaging the gear to just work the throttle. I did notice in the manual that the remote choke activates an electronic solenoid. I wonder if that is working. I'll check that also. Thanks for the thoughts.
Click to expand...

If the solenoid is working, then you should hear an audible click when it engages and snaps the choke butterfly closed on the carbs. I have had these not work many times - sometimes a weak solenoid, sometimes just needing some lube on the linkage, and I have had to replace the whole solenoid a time or two on various engines. It doesn't sound serious to me and since it runs great after a moment or two, I sort of doubt it is the primer bulb.
 
I am not a mechanic here, but here are a fewof thoughts.

1. Has the fuel always been treated with stabilizer?
2. Are you pumping the bulb until it is firm before trying to start the OB?
3. Are you being sure that the shifter lever is for sure in Neutral?
4. If you have a fuel/water separating filter, is there any water in that?

OK. now, beyond that it is above my paygrade.

Harvey
SleepyC:moon

9_Sept_Seq_2019_Cal.thumb.jpg
 
Get an album from the administrator TyBoo (in first 3 membership list). Take a photo of the Binnacle. I believe that all of the outboard binnacles do have a higher speed neutral release button. Also there will be an electric choke. Often this is a lever on the binnacle. With a photo we can identify what control you have.
 
Thanks for the thoughts.

In regard to Harvey's questions:
1) Tanks were clean and empty. Fuel is less than 2 weeks old.
2) I will check the bulb next week.
3) Shifter is definitely in neutral. Prop does not spin when starting.
4) Absolutely just clear gas in water separator bowl.

For Bob's comments--I will take photos next week. The manual only shows an "in gear" release for the other type of remote control, not the one I have. Photos will tell...
 
If this engine runs great outside of a moment or two when you first start it when cold, it isn't very likely there is trouble with the tank, primer bulb, lines, carbs, or anything else. But go ahead and check all of it as this engine is old and you may find something that needs attention. I'd be looking at the choke solenoid and also maybe checking to see what your battery voltage is while cranking if your battery has any time on it. Low battery cranking voltage causes many goofy things. The next time you try starting it, try pulling on the manual choke knob on the outboard itself. If it fires right up you have something going on with the cold start system. As a side note, it will also promptly die....there is such a thing as too much choke....lol.....
 
I’ve always believed that carbureted outboards need to be choked when cold.

I have a 1995 Merc 175 2 Stroke on an old Sea Ray and my procedure is:

1). Pump bulb until VERY firm
2). In neutral, pump throttle once
3). Push choke in while turning key (my choke is part of the ignition, you push the key in.
4). When it starts, push throttle to get up to about 2000 RPM and hold there for about a minute
5). If it sounds like it’s going to kill, push in choke momentarily
6) it should now idle well and not smoke too much.


On my C-Dory 22, I have a 2002 Yamaha 80, carbs but 4 stroke it’s much easier. Pump the bulb, choke while cranking, no need to advance throttle, starts quickly, then let idle for a couple minutes before applying speed. Non-ethanol gas and Sea Foam are your best friends!
 
If your controls don't have the "throttle button" on the side with a key-push actuated choke solenoid, but instead has a choke/fast idle lever, the manual says to lift the lever fully when starting. Then, after it starts lower the lever to a position that the engine doesn't stall while it warms up.

The first picture on page 61 in the manual shows where the fast idle range is, as well as where the choke engages with the lever travel...

https://cdn.powerequipment.honda.com/ma ... ZW0602.pdf
 
I have 2007 Honda BF50, same year as your but different model so can be some differences all that said your issue or starting process look very similar to mine. Per the owner manual, those have an automatic chock with no possible user input/adjustment and cannot disengage the throttle, but do have a fast idle lever to allow idle speed adjustment while keeping engine in neutral . Mine work best if i follow the recommendation of not using the fast idle lever until after the engine as run for a few second (about 15-30 S.) to give time for the bypass choke to do its thing. My engines are very consistent at not starting right away when cold and it seem to be a normal by product of that system. I usually run the starter for about 5 second at a time and they will start on the 2 or 3 try, I sometime move the throttle forward then back to neutral before starting if the engines have been sitting for a while, that seem to help.
Hope that help
 
Ken O,

Are you sure you can't adjust the throttle while in neutral? I have a 2006 Honda BF90. I push in the rubber "button" at the hinge of the throttle and that let's me give it gas while in neutral.

We have it down to a science. Prime the bulb about 12 times until it's firm. Bring the throttle up at least three-quarters. Push in the key (choke) and turn it. I work the throttle up and down for about 10 seconds and it starts up but then immediately dies. My wife squeezes the bulb a couple more times and then she starts right up.

Don't know if this is good or bad? I know you're not supposed to engage the starter for more than 10 seconds so I make sure not to do that but it takes close to 10 seconds to start when she's cold. After repriming the bulb she starts right up and we let her idle for a bit.
 
Lots of good information here. Thanks a bunch! I will be back at the boat next week. I will experiment and report.
 
The choke is an electric solenoid operated all or nothing choke. If you lift the fast idle/choke lever with the ignition on you will here the click of the solenoid at the last bit of lever travel. Backing off, the choke is released and the idle is held fast and controlled as you lower the lever you lower the idle. I find stuffing a key ring float under the lever gives a good speed to warm-up the engine while attending lines etc prior to leaving the dock/mooring, at least here in Maine. Be sure to remove the float or you will be unable to shift into gear(don't ask).
 
2007 BF90 was fuel injected. You either don't have a carb, or you have a 2006 or prior engine which is a totally different design than the Vtec fuel injected engines from 2007 and later.

If it's carbed it has a lever to the right side of the throttle you need to raise when starting the engine. It should be normal for it to take a few rotations for it to fire when its cold. All the carbed honda 90s Ive run have acted like that. If it runs great once it finally starts, and starts right up once its warmed up.. the engines just cold blooded and I wouldn't mess with it.
 
It definitely has 4 carbs. I was given the wrong info on the year then... Thanks for the info.
 
September 13, 2006 – Honda Motor Co., Ltd. introduced today the all-new BF90 and BF75 medium-sized*1 4-stroke marine outboard engines. The two new models will go on sale through Honda’s outboard dealers in Japan on November 1, 2006

Developed on the base of the 1.5-liter engine of the Honda Fit automobile, the new engines feature Honda’s PGM-FI programmed fuel injection system and lean-burn combustion, and VTEC*3. They also boast the world’s first ignition timing governed by BLAST*4 (Boosted Low Speed Torque) air/fuel ratio technology and other advanced electronic control devices Battery charging capacity has been more than doubled to a class-leading 35 amperes.
Click to expand...

The problem was getting the motors to the US dealers. So some 90's which were sold in 2007 still had carburetors.
 
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