Is this really happening?!!

S

South of Heaven

New member
I can't believe this is playing out like this BUT here's the series of events that have transpired in the past couple of days in my "C Dory life"!!...

I just sold my 16 and trailer to a retired guy from metro Boston. He called me, came down the next day, chatted for 5 minutes and bought it! Literally, I'm not exaggerating...I didn't even bring a bill of sale or boat title because I didn't think I needed it for a first time, middle of winter boat showing. Haha. I was wrong.

So that's it. Just as fast as I bought it the 16, I sold it. It's kinda melodramatic because I liked the boat a lot. I also learned a great deal about sea conditions and inclement weather etc (although I have a LOT MORE to learn, that's for sure). I went out almost twice a week on the boat from August until December; Fun times! That's for sure. I'm also glad that the boat went to someone who will appreciate her. Randy (the new owner) told me that he'd keep the boat "until he died". He seemed very sincere about that statement too, so I'm glad that the boat will be in good hands. I told him that when I get my next boat we should meet up in the Boston Harbor and do some cruising.

Okay, here's the CRAZY part (at least to me it's crazy!). As soon as I sold the boat I started combing through my notes and looking at boats that I've seen on the market since November. They mostly included used CD 19's and a few 22's but I also have been looking at some Arima 17-19 Sea Rangers and a Maritime Skiff model with a pilothouse. So EVERY old single posting of those boats were either deleted or sold. In my mind I was already thinking of just biting the bullet and buying a NEW 19 from a east coast dealer.....But then I came across a phone number that I had written down from a Craigslist ad for a 2003 19 from New York. The ad was expired but the note jogged my memory and I even remembered what the boat looked like. Lol. I'm not obsessive, am I?

Anyway, I thought for sure the boat must have been sold by now but it's still worth a shot or maybe he would leads on other boats for sale. So I call him and the 19 is still for sale!! He said one of the his potential buyers backed out in December and that he didn't re-advertise it. He was gonna wait until Spring to sell it. I couldn't believe it! I still can't believe it actually...So we chatted for a long time and decided on a price based on inspection and other things. The boat is currently wrapped and motor is winterized but he's willing to facilitate a showing and land trial. A sea trial is out of the question; it's like 20 degrees in the Northeast right now. I'll check the hull the best that I can on land? I also compiled a list of things that I'll check as well. But from what I can tell from the pictures and by talking to him; it seems to be a great hull and motor. It looks very well maintained and he seems to have done a lot to it.

SO, here I am. At this point I'm about 90% there to being a 2003 19 owner. We'll see what happens...The owner gave me his word that he'd hold it for me and doesn't even want a deposit. I think he sensed how interested aka neurotic I was about his boat and knows I'm a super motivated buyer. LOl.

Guys, what should I look for on a land trial? He said we're gonna start the motor via muffs, which is good. I'm more worried about the hull and core issues....How can I check the hull and see if there are any "soft spots" etc?

Thanks!
Jason 617.817.1136
 
South of Heaven":gknm385w said:
I can't believe this is playing out like this BUT here's the series of events that have transpired in the past couple of days in my "C Dory life"!!...

I just sold my 16 and trailer to a retired guy from metro Boston. He called me, came down the next day, chatted for 5 minutes and bought it! Literally, I'm not exaggerating...I didn't even bring a bill of sale or boat title because I didn't think I needed it for a first time, middle of winter boat showing. Haha. I was wrong.

So that's it. Just as fast as I bought it the 16, I sold it. It's kinda melodramatic because I liked the boat a lot. I also learned a great deal about sea conditions and inclement weather etc (although I have a LOT MORE to learn, that's for sure). I went out almost twice a week on the boat from August until December; Fun times! That's for sure. I'm also glad that the boat went to someone who will appreciate her. Randy (the new owner) told me that he'd keep the boat "until he died". He seemed very sincere about that statement too, so I'm glad that the boat will be in good hands. I told him that when I get my next boat we should meet up in the Boston Harbor and do some cruising.

Okay, here's the CRAZY part (at least to me it's crazy!). As soon as I sold the boat I started combing through my notes and looking at boats that I've seen on the market since November. They mostly included used CD 19's and a few 22's but I also have been looking at some Arima 17-19 Sea Rangers and a Maritime Skiff model with a pilothouse. So EVERY old single posting of those boats were either deleted or sold. In my mind I was already thinking of just biting the bullet and buying a NEW 19 from a east coast dealer.....But then I came across a phone number that I had written down from a Craigslist ad for a 2003 19 from New York. The ad was expired but the note jogged my memory and I even remembered what the boat looked like. Lol. I'm not obsessive, am I?

Anyway, I thought for sure the boat must have been sold by now but it's still worth a shot or maybe he would leads on other boats for sale. So I call him and the 19 is still for sale!! He said one of the his potential buyers backed out in December and that he didn't re-advertise it. He was gonna wait until Spring to sell it. I couldn't believe it! I still can't believe it actually...So we chatted for a long time and decided on a price based on inspection and other things. The boat is currently wrapped and motor is winterized but he's willing to facilitate a showing and land trial. A sea trial is out of the question; it's like 20 degrees in the Northeast right now. I'll check the hull the best that I can on land? I also compiled a list of things that I'll check as well. But from what I can tell from the pictures and by talking to him; it seems to be a great hull and motor. It looks very well maintained and he seems to have done a lot to it.

SO, here I am. At this point I'm about 90% there to being a 2003 19 owner. We'll see what happens...The owner gave me his word that he'd hold it for me and doesn't even want a deposit. I think he sensed how interested aka neurotic I was about his boat and knows I'm a super motivated buyer. LOl.

Guys, what should I look for on a land trial? He said we're gonna start the motor via muffs, which is good. I'm more worried about the hull and core issues....How can I check the hull and see if there are any "soft spots" etc?

Thanks!
Jason 617.817.1136
Click to expand...


Save your self a couple more bouts of THREEFOOTITIS & just get a 25 now!!


:lol: :lol:
 
tsturm":1pbndfb2 said:
Save your self a couple more bouts of THREEFOOTITIS & just get a 25 now!!


:lol: :lol:
Click to expand...
Come on! It will be more fun for the rest of us to see him this excited every few years. :wink:
 
Sounds like fun times!

It can be a bit hard to check for "soft spots" (i.e. damp or wet core/de-bonding) when it's 20ºF. Nothing will be "soft" (due to it being frozen), and, if I remember correctly, a moisture meter won't work correctly either. Likely tapping also won't sound like it would in warmer (i.e. non-frozen) weather. I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong - it's been a while since I've been in "up north" winter weather.

You can still look for signs of problems: Any leaking or "rusty" looking areas beneath the bow pulpit or other deck fittings (inside the boat), for example.

Also if a 2003 19 was built like my 2002 22, you'll want to look at the cleats that are meant to hold the fuel tanks/fuel tank covers in place. On my boat there were a number of problems: 1) No room was left for tank expansion; 2) Tank hold down straps were attached to tops of fuel tank covers (leverage); 3) Cleats were made of Starboard™ (doesn't take most bedding compounds well); 4) Cleats were screwed directly into hull core. Put those four things together and you have a cleat that is being "levered" out of balsa core and sealant that isn't doing anything. My boat had been stored inside and not used much and there were *still* quarter sized damp spots in the core where the cleat fasteners went in (I went to a different system altogether). I could see right when I looked at the boat that this was something I was going to be correcting first thing. Perhaps the 19 was different though.

Here is a photo showing what I mean about the original fuel tank cleats on my 22. This kind of tells it all. It's the first thing I changed. You can't see it in this photo, but the straps that were meant to hold the fuel tanks in place go from the bottom behind the tanks (footman loop on hull), to the TOP of the cover piece (not very secure since the cover piece was thin Starboard). Once the fuel tanks expanded (as the mfgr. points out they will do and specifies the expansion space that should be allowed), they just levered the cleats right out of the cockpit "sole." (There was no expansion space allowed for.)

fuel_tank_panels_cleats.jpg

fuel_tank_panel_close_up.jpg

Otherwise, for "hidden" things (including those not detectable in 20ºF weather), you may just have to use your judgement based on how the boat was kept (outdoors? in the water? year round? covered?) and how it looks, and then figure you'll fix anything that comes up. Most boats will have something(s). Not that you don't want to check them over and avoid certain issues. But I find that you can usually get a pretty good idea based on the overall appearance of the boat. Not always, but usually. (I still tap and use a moisture meter, but then that's when it's warm out; but usually those only find things I already pretty much knew were there anyway due to visual inspection, prior research, common sense, etc.)

Happy shopping! If not this boat, then another one :thup
 
Congratulations.
great surprise there. Of the C Dorys I have purchased, only the first 22, and the new Tom Cat got sea trials.

I doubt that the person who bought your 16 will keep it the rest of his life. But...you never know.

As far as a "land trial"--that is OK--but what are you going to tell abut the engine other than it runs, by running it on muffs? Are you going to do compression checks? Leak down? Pull the plug on the lower unit?

What engine is on the boat is the first question I would ask? How many hours?

What you will not know is how the engine will perform under load. It will be a 12 to 13 year old engine. If it is a low her 4 stroke, then 90% chance it is OK.

The boat will ride better than your 16 did.

I would send him a deposit--small, but get a sales agreement.

Many owners will buy a 22 after owning a 19 for a short time. The 19 is a good boat. The 22 angler has a bigger cockpit--and the 22 cruiser has full accommodations. The tow vehicle for the 19 and 22 can be the same. but you will have to buy a new tow vehicle. The Volvo coupe will not do the job! A 25 will require a bigger tow vehicle. There is a 22 for sale in New York currently--go look at it, while you have driven down.

You had said you "dreamed about owning a 22" in a post less than 6 months ago. Of the boats you mention, the 19 or a 22 is going to be the best--but I am prejudiced.

Good luck!
 
This is what happens when everything in the universe lines up, the C-Dory universe.
Thanks for sharing your story, we've all been there, too, if we are fortunate like you. You're gonna love that 19. Keep us informed. :D
 
In 1994 I was sitting in a dumpy coffee house in Seattle reading an old copy of the Portland Oregonian. I found my dream car (1973 Volvo ES) for sale. I called and the owner still had it. Drove down and towed it home. No test drive, no nothing. I just sold the car last month.

Same with my CD 16. The ad was a couple months old. When I called the broker, the first thing he said was that the price had been dropped. I drove to Campbell River and towed it home. No sea trial, no nothing.

Why? The price. In both cases I couldn't complain if I found that I needed to put in some time and a few thousand dollars (which I would be doing anyway). We haven't heard the sales price, motor hours, etc. on the CD 19. For me, that might be enough to seal the deal without further inspection.

I agree that you need a purchase agreement. The owner says that it isn't necessary, meaning that it isn't necessary for him. He can keep his options open. For you to spend more time and money, you need to make sure that he is serious. All it takes is for somebody (usually a know-nothing brother-in-law) to tell him that he is selling it too cheap and the "deal" is off.

Mark
 
Sunbeam: Good info. Thanks for the heads up. It's definitely gonna be difficult with these cold temps up here.

Thataway I bought a 2016 Volvo S60 last month. It actually has a 3300 lb towing capacity. That's one of the reasons why I bought it. I'm not a fan of pickups and SUVS. I used to have a Benz SUV.... The other thing is that I won't be towing that far during my normal boating season. On average it'll be between less than 50 miles round trip. Most of the season I'll be storing the boat at my waterfront summer Cape home (on land though, we don't have a dock. Although my neighbor offered to let me use his dock.). When I'm doing that then I'll be towing for like 1 mile to the town ramp... I put some pics of my new tow vehicle in my album! Glad the trailer has surge brakes and mostly all aluminum.

Check out this link. #8...

http://www.autobytel.com/crossovers/car ... ks-119920/




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Salmon Fisher":2oxmlij0 said:
This is what happens when everything in the universe lines up, the C-Dory universe.
Thanks for sharing your story, we've all been there, too, if we are fortunate like you. You're gonna love that 19. Keep us informed. :D
Click to expand...

Thanks, will do! :)
 
That Volvo is a great car. I have a number of friends who love them. Great reviews on towing.

My one concern is does the Volvo have the capacity to tow the 19? Rated at 3300 lbs. ( I found several places where the spec was 3500 lbs) The factory difference in weight between the hull of the 19 and the 22 cruiser is only 1650 vs 1925, or a different of 275 lbs. Although the factory specs give the towing weight of the 19 at 3000 lbs, and Wefing's gives a weight of 3500 lbs, I would want to see what this boat weighs on a scale.

To make things even more interesting, the factory hull weight on the 22 angler is only 50 lbs more than the 19, but they give the tow weight as a more realistic 4100 lbs ! For some reasons the factory towing weight is given at 3500 lbs for the cruiser. Most of us find that the 22 cruiser is closer to 4500 lbs, and some tip the scales at 5000.

One other issue you need to find out about, is the hitch weight capacity. I have seen mentioned both 165# and 350#. This supposes minimal weight in the car--probably little in the back seat or trunk. The GVWR of the T6 is 3712#, the GCWR is 7546#. Carrying Capacity (passengers, fuel, gear) is 942#. Be sure you have at least a class III hitch.

There is a chance that the 19 is going to be over the 3300 lbs towing weight limitation of your car. Sure you can tow it the mile to the ramp--I move boats as big os the 22 with a garden tractor The bigger issue may come in the 50 miles from home to the cape. Will the car pull the weight--absolutely. Is braking going to be OK--probably. In an emergency--not sure. If there is an accident, and it will be revealed that you are towing a load over the rated capacity, there may be a very serious issue.

Just be safe! Folks do short runs at near or over capacity and get by....there is some risk. Lots of exciting developments in your life! (Did you win the Power Ball? :)
 
thataway":3gn07jg3 said:
That Volvo is a great car. I have a number of friends who love them. Great reviews on towing.

My one concern is does the Volvo have the capacity to tow the 19? Rated at 3300 lbs. ( I found several places where the spec was 3500 lbs) The factory difference in weight between the hull of the 19 and the 22 cruiser is only 1650 vs 1925, or a different of 275 lbs. Although the factory specs give the towing weight of the 19 at 3000 lbs, and Wefing's gives a weight of 3500 lbs, I would want to see what this boat weighs on a scale.

To make things even more interesting, the factory hull weight on the 22 angler is only 50 lbs more than the 19, but they give the tow weight as a more realistic 4100 lbs ! For some reasons the factory towing weight is given at 3500 lbs for the cruiser. Most of us find that the 22 cruiser is closer to 4500 lbs, and some tip the scales at 5000.

One other issue you need to find out about, is the hitch weight capacity. I have seen mentioned both 165# and 350#. This supposes minimal weight in the car--probably little in the back seat or trunk. The GVWR of the T6 is 3712#, the GCWR is 7546#. Carrying Capacity (passengers, fuel, gear) is 942#. Be sure you have at least a class III hitch.

There is a chance that the 19 is going to be over the 3300 lbs towing weight limitation of your car. Sure you can tow it the mile to the ramp--I move boats as big os the 22 with a garden tractor The bigger issue may come in the 50 miles from home to the cape. Will the car pull the weight--absolutely. Is braking going to be OK--probably. In an emergency--not sure. If there is an accident, and it will be revealed that you are towing a load over the rated capacity, there may be a very serious issue.

Just be safe! Folks do short runs at near or over capacity and get by....there is some risk. Lots of exciting developments in your life! (Did you win the Power Ball? :)
Click to expand...

Yeah, lots of new developments as of recent BUT none of which include me winning the PowerBall unfortunately.. :)

I also found some articles that showed the car's towing capacity at 3500 lbs. But I'm gonna go with the 3300lb limit to be safe. From what I could gather my tongue weight limit is 350 lbs. Also checked that via the eTrailer website.

2016 Volvo S60
Weights and Capacities
MAXIMUM TOWING CAPACITY** 3500 lbs. CURB WEIGHT 3433 lbs.
CARGO CAPACITY, ALL SEATS IN PLACE 12.0 cu.ft.

I definitely agree with the Brats and don't wanna tow over my car's limit and be unsafe BUT I still think that the total weight will be under 3k lbs.

The boat in it's current state is not set up for cruising at all. There is only one battery and not much else. The trailer is aluminum and has surge brakes. It's weight is 690, pretty light for a well equipped setup. The motor is an 03 Yamaha F80. I'm pretty sure it was spec'd at 356 lbs if I remember?

So this is what I'm calculating:
Boat- 1650
Trailer-690

Motor- 356
Fuel, cooler, accessories, batteries-300

TOTAL----2,996 lbs

That leaves me with another 300 lbs to hit my limit 3,300.

Guys, I know I'm splitting hairs here with these exact weight numbers but my contention is that I'm gonna have a light 19. I can't wait to weigh it a truck scale! Another huge factor is that eastern Mass is totally flat....
 
The Volvo Manual for your car lists 165 tongue and 3300 as your towing maximums. I have done this dance before and the numbers in the manual are the only numbers that matter. Other numbers you hear are often based on the hitch rating and not the car its bolted to. Your warranty and liability is not based on the hitch part rating. I have reconfigured (including axle movement) our current trailer three times to minimize the height and minimize tongue weight. I had a hard time maintaining towing stability with anything less than 200lbs on the hitch using a King 3700s trailer. How often do folks stand on the tongue to reach up on the bow or while launching or retrieving? I would be careful of that as well.

Our 19 sits as low as possible on the trailer so that we can easily float the boat on/off without submerging the rear end of the tow vehicle (Hyundai Sante Fe). That Volvo looks really low so I would scout out your launch ramps carefully and rank them by steepness which is a good thing so long as you have traction.

I totally understand your yearning to avoid having a more traditional tow vehicle and have done the same in the past even towing with a small 4cyl wagon for a couple of years. But as the weight goes up past 2000lbs, it doesn't always work well enough to make sense, so monitor that closely to keep smiling.

With our last boat (Lund Impact), towed with a 4x4 Kia Sportage, we actually turned around and headed home twice in the beginning because we could not get enough water under the boat to launch it without flooding the car. A wider but significantly larger/heavier trailer solved that for us.

You have to work harder to tow without a truck, but it can be worth it.

Greg
 
Also, think about the additions you may want. Kicker, house battery, tools/spares, fishing/crabbing/shrimping gear, safety gear, dinghy, canvas tops, cockpit flooring, lines and fenders, clothing/bedding....

Page 279-280 of the S60 Volvo manual also states a 50mph speed limit while towing and de-rating of 10% above 3280 ft above sea level.

I don't want to say it, but are you sure you found your tow vehicle? With our 19 at 4400 lbs for a trip this summer, I would be hard pressed to shave 1000+ lbs away and still have any fun. The aluminum trailer is only saving 150-250lbs.
 
Get a Venture 23 and a Tacoma. Works for me!

Just kidding. Congratulations on selling your boat and finding what you want so quickly. I have to say, that Volvo, while a GREAT car, probably isn't right for towing a 19.
 
Greg has real life experience with the 19, after a number of other boats--so I would listen very carefully to his experience.

My 22 has a fairly short tongue, so I often have to put the real axle (not just the tires in the water. Exhaust under water or the bottom of the bumper in fresh water---much less in salt water--is the limit for me.

My Caracal, has an extra long tongue, which helps a lot, since being a cat, it will tend to sit a little higher on the trailer.

Since you will be mostly at Cape Cod--you have salt water, and I would not want to have any more than the bottom of the rear tires in the water. There is a solution to that, which is a tongue extension--often used to launch deeper sailboats from a ramp.
 
Just as a comparison, I have a 22, also with the F80. I have a galvanized tandem trailer, so heavier than aluminum - although it has 13" wheels and is not super beefy (rated plenty for the load, but I have seen heavier trailers).

I weigh often, as I just like to know. I don't have tons of "accessories" (no steel frame/camperback, no windlass [yet], no fishing stuff, etc. On the other hand I usually have a few tubs of tools and that sort of thing in the boat. Likely adding a few hundred pounds. I do tow with fuel and water tanks empty. I have a kicker engine.

Anyway, with all that, I come out at around 4,600# total trailer weight, of which around 330# is tongue weight. It tows quite well. Note that with a tandem you don't need the "traditional" 10% of tongue weight - I've read 5-7%. I have around 7%.

I have to say that although I'm sure "your" 19 will be lighter on the trailer, I can't imagine how it could weigh 1,300# less (which would be your maxed out tow weight). I guess you'll find out, and maybe it is somehow that much lighter.
 
There are definitely a lot of factors at play here. Thanks for your firsthand accounts Aurelia. I can't wait to get this boat/trailer weighed! One thing is for sure I'm gonna buy the 19 (hopefully, lol). After that I'll decide on the tow vehicle. I'm not against buying a proper tow vehicle IF that's my last resort. But I would probably lean more towards keeping the boat at my neighbors house for the season or possibly renting a slip. I'm still confident though! We shall see..

Thataway: Agreed. I definitely don't want my exhaust submerged!
 
Rain":2cet60od said:
Get a Venture 23 and a Tacoma. Works for me!

Just kidding. Congratulations on selling your boat and finding what you want so quickly. I have to say, that Volvo, while a GREAT car, probably isn't right for towing a 19.
Click to expand...

Thanks Rain. Congrats again on your new boat too. Here's to an epic 2016!
 
South of heaven, Congrats on the sale of your 16 and on finding the next right one so quick. I agree with Bob in recommending taking a close look at Greg (Aurelia) as he has really worked through much of what you are looking at already.

The gentleman who set up my boat (a 22 Cruiser) was working on the 34th boat of his life time, and the C-Dory 22 was going to be his last boat, as a retirement investment, He was primarily a fisherman, and his wife was the cruiser influence. After going through all those boats, I think he had a pretty good handle on "boats", as in what worked, went well, and gave the best bang for the buck. I think that is why he went "C-Dory" and "22".

For my $0.02, I'd recommend getting a good look at and ride in the 19 and then side by side a 22. If your mission is to boat, then make that a priority, and let the tow vehicle fall in place around the primary objective. JMHT.

I know we all have parameters that life has to fit into, so sometimes we just do what we have to and accept that. Dreams and goals. Time is as it is. We have to be realistic, so you do what you need to. Just some thoughts here.

Harvey
SleepyC :moon

IMGP1872.thumb.jpg
 
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