Single Vs. Twin Engine Pro/Com

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PNWNEWM

New member
I've searched the threads, and surely overlooked something, but thought I'd start a new post.

I'm in search of a 22' Cruiser and there are a couple options out there. There are both single engine boats with Honda 90's or a couple twin engine bats with Honda 50s & 40s. What are some pros and cons to going with the single or the twins? Thank you in advance!

Ryan
 
Kind of like asking which is better, Ford or Chevy! lol. My take is that they both have advantages and disadvantages over the other. Unless you are ordering a new boat and need to decide rather to go twins or a single, as long as the power on the boat is in good shape and runs well, I wouldn't even make that a consideration in purchasing. All the newer outboards have excellent reliability. I have always had singles on all four of the boats I've ever owned, but with my two C-Dorys have had kickers. (Trolling and peace of mind as I do a lot more remote water boating.) But there are a lot of commercial vessels out there running with just singles as well. Colby
 
Twin Pro- spare engine if one goes out...thats it.
Twin Cons - Higher total weight for Hp. Higher total cost for Hp ( mostly). Twice the maintenance cost. Most of the events that will take down your motor , prop strike, fuel, electrical, will take out both motor not just one.

Single Pros- less cost maintenance and weight then a set of twins even if you add a small kickers ( Depends on choices of brands and h.p.) You can troll on just the kicker and save fuel. If you lose the main the kicker will get you home just as fast as one of the twins if the other goes out. You can not plane a cdory on a 40 or 50 hp with two motors on the back. Hull speed is hull speed. A kicker can have a separate fuel source and all so be pull started so fuel and electrical problems that take out both twins will not effect a kicker if you plan for it. Most prop strikes happen at plan when your kicker is up and out of the water.

The single vs twin argument has all been the wrong discussion. It should really be the single with a kicker vs twins. I have towed people with twins and people with singles. I have not towed a person with a kicker..

I have lost a prop and got home, well to a nice canadian port for a fix, in a few hours. 5 mph.
 
I agree with Tom with one proviso....

On my Vancouver Island circumnavigation last summer, it was very clear to me that if I lost my single engine in the typical conditions I found on the west side, a kicker would have done me no good......just not enough power. Maybe, just maybe, a kicker would have enabled me to stay bow to the waves, but I'd rather have a sea anchor for that.

As foolish as it might be, my only plan if something had happened, would have been to deploy the sea anchor, and then my anchor with my entire rode out. I figured if I drifted toward shore where the only real danger was, I would eventually catch bottom and avoid the rocks. (BTW, I saw many pleasure boats out there fishing for halibut anchored to the bottom in 300 feet of water.) Hopefully that would buy me the time needed to get rescued via an SOS alert issued by my Inreach, or perhaps a VHF mayday to another boat in the area.
 
Oh boy here we go again! Ha Ha

Twin pros: Awesome maneuverability at the dock, shallower draft with smaller lower units (on plane to), it costs me $90 dollars total for both outboard's maint., two engines have way more lower end torque than a single with less needed hp. than a single engine boat. Six blades!

Kicker w/ a single is still a twin engine boat! :lol:

Your turn singles. :wink:
 
For us the 9.9 Suzuki kicker is a must for salmon fishing. We have never needed the kicker for emergency use. One thing to consider is if twins hit a rock and both motors are taken out of service, that would be a bad thing. I like having a kicker out of the water and available for emergency use. Our kicker pushes the boat at about 5.5 knots which is within hull speed.
 
smckean (Tosca)":3v59lwt1 said:
I agree with Tom with one proviso....

On my Vancouver Island circumnavigation last summer, it was very clear to me that if I lost my single engine in the typical conditions I found on the west side, a kicker would have done me no good......just not enough power. Maybe, just maybe, a kicker would have enabled me to stay bow to the waves, but I'd rather have a sea anchor for that.

As foolish as it might be, my only plan if something had happened, would have been to deploy the sea anchor, and then my anchor with my entire rode out. I figured if I drifted toward shore where the only real danger was, I would eventually catch bottom and avoid the rocks. (BTW, I saw many pleasure boats out there fishing for halibut anchored to the bottom in 300 feet of water.) Hopefully that would buy me the time needed to get rescued via an SOS alert issued by my Inreach, or perhaps a VHF mayday to another boat in the area.
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Sandy, I think you would be surprised how much power that the kicker would provide. As long as you have less than 5 kts of current, it'll move you. Even worse case, just having something to keep your bow into the waves would help. But as you said, a sea anchor and/or regular anchor will help do that. Colby
 
-Waypoint-":ryk423dj said:
Oh boy here we go again! Ha Ha

Twin pros: Awesome maneuverability at the dock, shallower draft with smaller lower units (on plane to), it costs me $90 dollars total for both outboard's maint., two engines have way more lower end torque than a single with less needed hp. than a single engine boat. Six blades!

Kicker w/ a single is still a twin engine boat! :lol:

Your turn singles. :wink:
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I'll dock anywhere with my single that you can with your twins. :beer
That extra low end torque is going to cost you in added drag. :mrgreen:
Maintenance is still going to cost more than only replacing one water pump, or oil filter, or fuel filter. :wink:

Personally, I'd be happy with either twins or a single. Just learn to use what's there, and keep them maintained so they keep running. :D Colby
 
For sure, the single twin is going to outperform the kicker & actually give boat control where there would not be control with a kicker in many of the sea conditions, where I’ve been & rescue in time would not have been an option. Last summer in remote outside waters of SE Alaska, I was entering Piehle Passage in poor conditions & due to the conditions I got a little off the route & had one twin wrapped up with kelp & the other auto shut off from blocked water intake. This was while extremely close to rocks awash. In these seas a kicker would have been pretty much useless even if one had time to get it started. Fortunately, I was able to get one of the twins back going very quickly, so control back & off the rocks while getting the other twin back going too. I’ve been through many of these kind of passages or close in around shallow rocky areas, where the loss of a single would have had me on the rocks before a kicker could have been activated & even if started not enough control to help in the conditions. Yes, having a failure like this would be a rare event, but the same could be said about most of the safety items, we all have aboard.

Twin maintenance does cost more & the original purchase price higher. For me this is balanced out by extended maintenance periods with less hours on the individual motors due to running the majority of the time on one at low speed. on my extended SE Alaska cruises, I’ve never had to change oil during the cruise, as I would have had to do if running a single. My old Honda twin forty’s had about 2400 hours on them when replaced. If I’d been running a single during the same period it would have had over 4000 hours.

For many who boat where towing service is available & seldom if ever push the envelope a single with no kicker is fine. For those of us that do & in remote places, I believe the twins over a single & kicker has more pros than cons.

I too, over the years have towed several boats, who were stranded with motor problems. These all were either singles or a single with a kicker & not yet one with twins, not that it won’t happen in the future.

Bottom line, like Colby, I would be happy with either a single with kicker or twins, but not a single without a kicker. If the HunkyDory had the single with kicker when we purchased it 21 years ago, no doubt that’s what I would happily be running now.

Jay
 
Ok, I'll bite. The single vs twins can be more of an emotional debate rather than technical. I've owned 15 boats, 8 were power. My CD25 is the first with twins. Here's my experience:
1) Yes, maintenance is more costly, but it has been a minor cost of ownership compared to other costs and upkeep.
2) I do my own maintenance, on many occasions it's been extremely valuable to have another 'like' motor right at hand to compare to, either to see how something is assembled or to see what is normal and what isn't.
3) Handling either at speed (twins hold a steadier course for me) or dock maneuvering in wind is exceptional. I used to do it with a single just fine, but I find if I make an unexpected error or there's a quick shift in conditions, I'm able to maintain better control and recovery with the twins.
4) Gas mileage is approximately the same with either twins or double-sized single. This surprised (and delighted) me. I guess it's due to less stress on each engine.
5) One of my earlier boats was a 21ft Reinell cuddy cabin cruiser with a main and kicker. It was only a 6hp kicker. My main's rectifier went out and the engine died (smoking). I was 8nm from the marina in open sea in windy and wavy conditions. I did make it back, but crabbed into the wind and waves all the way back, took maybe 3 hours, everyone got sick as well. I've had to come back on one engine with my present boat in moderately nasty conditions; control and speed was significantly better, was able to easily maintain 6-7 knots.
For the C-Dory and it's light front end and cabin side windage, I definitely prefer twins if I had a choice.
 
I agree with starcraftom except for two points
1) You can easily plane on a single twin with the right setup. I have a heavyish CD22 with twin 40 Hondas with 4 bladed Solas aluminum props, 11x11, I believe. No problem planing on one but WOT is just 4500 rpm - if I remember correctly doing about 12 mph.
2) I've only trashed one prop (embarrassing) but admit two at the same time is more likely. I always carry two spares.

It's a personal choice, Jay
 
Thank you all for the replies! For my needs, I think the single with a kicker is the ticket. Nothing too remote, and if off shore should be on days and locations where other boats are within striking distance for help. I'm excited to get out on the water and to be part of this community. Thanks again!
 
PNWNEWM":126ttm2x said:
Thank you all for the replies! For my needs, I think the single with a kicker is the ticket. Nothing too remote, and if off shore should be on days and locations where other boats are within striking distance for help. I'm excited to get out on the water and to be part of this community. Thanks again!
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As your search for a C-Dory continues, I wouldn't worry too much about rather or not the boat has a single or twins. If you find a boat that is well cared for and the engine(s) are mechanically sound, don't turn the boat down because it has twins, or because it has a single. Good luck finding one sooner than later! Colby
 
Ryan, by considering a C-Dory, you have already made a good choice. For those looking to buy, this site has good information to help make a perfect boat.

Consider joining us at our annual Friday Harbor, C-Brats gathering next month. There will be about 30 C-Dory boats present along with representation from NW Marine Industries who build C-Dory Boats. You will learn a lot and this may help you in your purchase decisions.

On Saturday, there will be a 2 PM book exchange/time of sharing, 5 PM potluck and a C-Dory swag giveaway for those mooring in a C-Dory.
 
colbysmith":2mwsvgx8 said:
Sandy, I think you would be surprised how much power that the kicker would provide. As long as you have less than 5 kts of current, it'll move you.
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Understand. However, it's not speed thru the water that I am referencing; it is sea state. I was a bit surprised coming down the west coast of Vancouver Island how much power it required to "drive up" large swells; and even more so, how I had to use the throttle to "dance" in chaotic large wind waves. When the wind waves were 6 or 7 feet high, and especially when they came from multiple directions, I had to accelerate and decelerate strongly and constantly to maintain control. I just can't believe I would have had a chance with a 10 horsepower engine.
 
smckean (Tosca)":3p0ihiks said:
colbysmith":3p0ihiks said:
Sandy, I think you would be surprised how much power that the kicker would provide. As long as you have less than 5 kts of current, it'll move you.
Click to expand...
Understand. However, it's not speed thru the water that I am referencing; it is sea state. I was a bit surprised coming down the west coast of Vancouver Island how much power it required to "drive up" large swells; and even more so, how I had to use the throttle to "dance" in chaotic large wind waves. When the wind waves were 6 or 7 feet high, and especially when they came from multiple directions, I had to accelerate and decelerate strongly and constantly to maintain control. I just can't believe I would have had a chance with a 10 horsepower engine.
Click to expand...

Yep!
 
Harvey on SleepyC is the twin guy.

I really like twin Yanmars on my B-28. Since the props are spread out, i really get the benefit of turning on axis. I've heard twin outboards being closer together, the benefit isn't as strong, but still there.
 
Sandy, great example in what you describe. It takes a lot of power to climb up a steep wave and to maintain control. In this situation, having twins would be better than having a kicker as long as at-least one twin motor is operational.
 
As a test to myself to prove that I could do it with twins. I entered my marina, did a 90 degree right turn, straight ahead for about 200 ft, 90 degree left turn, then 50 ft straight, followed by a 90 degree right turn into my slip. All this was achieved without me touching the steering wheel once. Such is the manouverability with twins.

Martin.
 
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