Uncomfortable without compass

P

potter water

New member
I have the ray marine integrated system but no old fashioned compass in Still Crazy. Has anyone had experience placing a compass where it can be easily seen from the helm and not overly interfered with by the Ray Marine integrated system??
 
Although is may sound like nautical heresy, I question how vital a mounted compass is in modern vessels.

These days most vessels have very reliable GPS systems, and many folks even carry a battery powered backup GPS unit.

Many vessels have binoculars with built-in compasses and/or autopilot with direction finding capability.

Still ... if you just aren't comfortable without a compass onboard, buy yourself a decent Boy Scout/Silva compass. It's reliable, small, and can be used for direction finding or checking a cross bearing to a shoreward landmark. And it stores easily in your ditch-bag.

Casey
 
I could not agree more. with gps and a compass display on the screen there is no need for a mounted compass.
that said I always carry a hand held compass as a back up. I also have a compass app on my cell phone. and then there is the sun, which we don't see much here but I know where its hiding. unless you are crossing really big water or are in the fog i don't see a use for one. Now if I was fishing Florida that would be different. I worry more about my depth finder going out then anything else.
 
Everyones different. I for one still like to carry paper charts,dividers, paralell rulers,and a hand bearing compass, with other old school relics to some. Lots of marinas still use compass bearings for directions etc. Coastal Explorer provides compass bearings in between waypoints. Never can tell if your your wiz bang GPS multi function goes on the fritz. You can feel responsible for your nav the old fashion way. Back to the compass; for what they cost why not get a good one.
For me, on the other hand my compass is in a nice spot, center of the boat on the dash. The problem being I'd like to set a laptop right where it sits. Using Coastal Explorer software and a portable GPS puck velcro'ed down to the dash looking out the window, I already have a 15.5" screen with a completely separate GPS unit with planning and cruising modes with all free charts, plus Active Captain intregated in with the software for about 1000 dollars. 500 for the laptop, 100 for the GPS puck and 400 dollars for the software. Thousands less than a 12'' screen GPS. The software is less than what a couple of the super dupper Garmin chips cost. Right now the compass is holding it's position. But sooner or later the compass will lose it's current spot.
D.D.
 
I agree with Tom. I have a fixed mount GPS that runs off the boat house battery. I have a portable GPS that runs off of AA batteries. I have another GPS in my phone with charts for the region that runs off the phone's battery. I have another GPS with charts for the region in an i-pad. I'm confident that I'll never be lost as long as the satellites remain operational. On the other hand, when trolling slow in the fog and currents, no GPS can really provide the true direction that the bow is pointing. Then a compass is handy if you want to keep the bow in a certain direction so you don't get pushed back over your gear.
 
My only concern with a handheld compass is the effect of the electronics on the compass when they are powered on. My Raymarine C-80 generates a lot of spurious RF which translates to the AM radio next to it is unusable when it is on. This can also affect the accuracy of a handheld compass. I haven't experimented much with various electronics on and off, but that is on the list for this summer. I have a Ritchie compass mounted near the front window, but haven't gone through the "swinging" (I think that is the right term) the compass to be sure it is accurate in that location.

I have played around with the compass in the IPhone and frankly I'm not sure if I would use it to find the shore in a lake. If you put three IPhones side by side, you will get three different compass readings. If you swap the phones with each other in the row, you will get another 3 compass readings all varying by as much as 15 degrees. The IPhones mutually affect each others compasses differently. The same can said for any other electrical device or large mass of iron or steel near the phone. While IPhone is a pretty good phone, it's a pretty bad compass with a really nice display in my experience.
 
I had one of those two slot plastic cupholders up against the windshield in the right side of the helm window in which I kept a standard, old time, inexpensive marine compass. I used it many many times. Fuses blew out on the Raymarine E80s in a storm. A handheld GPS saved my bacon on one time, but other times I could not get a good read on the handheld.

I frequently checked the Raymarine E-80s influence on the compass and it was negligible to my thoughts. Less than a degree or two at most.

John
 
We agree that the compass on the iPhone is not as reliable as a good hand-held Boy Scout compass (as Casey says). But the GPS in the iPhone4 is very good and one can inexpensively load charts into the iPhone from a Navionics app. In the dense fog, when your chartplotter or boat power goes down and you don't know where you are, all those neat nav instruments of old (including the compass) will probably be of little use - but the iPhone, with its own battery power, independent of the boat systems, shows you where you are on a good chart. With a few other apps, it even tells you if there is commercial traffic nearby (and the boat name) and the tides.

Knowing where you are on a chart, the iPhone compass (or the Boy Scout hand held that we carry) can head you in the right direction for shelter, anchorage, home, or whatever.
 
I have been reading about iPhone compass calibration. When you get the message that you need to calibrate you are suppose to move it in a figure eight several times. However, supposedly when you are in the presence of many electronic fields you should ignore the message and let the compass self correct from turns you make. The example given was a car dashboard. I have no idea if this really works but it seems fairly easy to check. Just set the iPhone compass to true north and see if it corrects to the gps while traveling.

Ron
 
An electronic compass, based on a GPS, is only effective if you are moving. If your engines quit, you are not moving a few mph, and you need to get a bearing to land, it will not work.

A magnetic compass, OTOH, will always tell you where NSEW is, unless the earth quits spinning and then, who cares.. :roll:

Charlie
 
I like my KVH 1000 for helping to maintain a steady course or whish way to go to get back on course if I am running manually. Yes it is electronic, a fluxgate type, but it is calibrated and works. I also have a pair of Binoculars with a compass that works really well for a hand bearing compass. There is also a small magnetic compass on board and a secondary GPS with a compass function and basic chart function too. I not really fond of paper charts, but I do use them at times, and I really like the C-120 acerage.

Harvey
SleepyC :moon
 
I have been reading about iPhone compass calibration. When you get the message that you need to calibrate you are suppose to move it in a figure eight several times. However, supposedly when you are in the presence of many electronic fields you should ignore the message and let the compass self correct from turns you make. The example given was a car dashboard. I have no idea if this really works but it seems fairly easy to check. Just set the iPhone compass to true north and see if it corrects to the gps while traveling.

Ron
 
I have the front center mounted compass and was trying to install some AM/FM radio speakers. As a trial I set one speaker up high on the overhead center front shelf on port side (without power) and then looked at the compass. It had shifted 15 degrees. Further playing showed that speaker has to go behind the dinette to avoid affecting the compass. It makes me wonder about the accuracy of the bino & hand held compasses. So, if you are a "compass guy" don't get sucked off course by your electronic gear such as CD players, radios & etc. In this case it was the heavy magnet in the speaker that was creating the problem. If I mount the speaker on the back wall of my CD22 and then stand in back with a hand compass or bino compass will I get a true reading? MMMmmm?
Chuck
 
The time when a magnetic compass can really save you is when the power to the dash instruments goes out. Could be a blown fuse, or short in the wiring. That is when a magnetic compass will work accurately as there is no electronic interference. The compass could be mounted permanently or be on a removable mount.

Bill said:
In the dense fog, when your chartplotter or boat power goes down and you don't know where you are, all those neat nav instruments of old (including the compass) will probably be of little use
Click to expand...

To me, being in a dense fog is the time to be situationally aware of your position and course. You know by checking your chartplotter. Then, if the magic box quits, you know which way to steer and how long it should take. Beats running in circles until you are really lost.

I should add that I don't have a smart phone, so I don't know how that works out, but I do boat where there is no cell coverage at all, so the smart phone is just another blank screen.
 
I have an old Navy binnacle and a Danforth Constellation compass with a 5" card that I have mounted in all of the larger boats I have owned. I refuse to sell it with the boats so I remove it -- it now sits on a shelf in my living room waiting for another boat -- if we get a C-Dory it may not fit in well, we will have to see. I would not do any offshore cruising without a magnetic compass and paper charts. We always know where we are on the charts as the GPS leads us on our voyage. Maybe I am old fashioned, or maybe I worked for too many computer companies (IBM 30 years) and know too much about software. Ed
 
Ed-

Thanks for the "vote of confidence"! :smileo

It's always nice to hear directly from a professional about the true nature of the subject at hand and cut through the corporate P.R. smokescreen! :wink

Sometimes only those on the inside really know who or what to trust! :disgust

Joe. :teeth :thup
 
Larry H":3m3grst8 said:
<stuff clipped>
I should add that I don't have a smart phone, so I don't know how that works out, but I do boat where there is no cell coverage at all, so the smart phone is just another blank screen.
Click to expand...
Not true - even without cell coverage, the GPS still works just fine. With the Navionics app, all the charts are downloaded as stored in the phone - no cel coverage necessary after that is done. E.g., it's another backup GPS.
 
From what I have seen, most people mount a fixed compass on the dash over the v-berth opening as D.D. Will-C mentioned, which has the associated tradeoffs that location entails. Some mount it various distances left or right of center, but never have I seen a vertical mount compass used on a c-dory. On the CD25 there is adequate room between the center and right windows for a vertical mount compass above the dash, which is in line with forward vision for easy viewing by the pilot without obstructing the view or taking up valuable dash space. I don’t know about electrical interference at this location, however.

Whereas I understand why many people eschew the old style magnetic compass in this day and age, there is little risk or downside to having one onboard. At a minimum it provides an aesthetic quality, and it represents a connection with our seafaring past that some of us find attractive. This thread is similar to a recent one discussing the merits, and demerits, of having a barometer on board. I piped up in favor of having as many weather instruments as possible on the boat no matter how useless they are. But that’s just my interest, and I am perhaps unique in having an anemometer on my boat (shown below). I am currently looking at marine rain gauges.

Anemometer.sized.jpg
 
On the Bartenderboats.com website they have a new displacement modle and the pictures of it show a compass mounted on the cabin roof in front of the helm-ie outside. This should get it away from electroniocs and still be easily visable. the only downside I can see is that salt spray on the windshield might obscure it. I have a bulkhead mount compass from my last sailboat that I'm going to mount in a teak box (actually a wedge shaped box) and give it a try. It will be about 3 1/2 - 4' away from my eyes--closer than it was on the sailboat most of the time so it should be easily visable and it won't obscure any of my forward view. I like steering by compass and wouldn't be without a compass and paper charts. My experience with boats is that things go wrong at the worse times and that sooner or latter they will and do go wrong. Being prepared for that eventuality makes life much easier (and safer)!
Michael
 
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