Windlass Doesn't Operate -Battery Arrangement

D

dread

New member
When I toggle my windlass switch to down or up, nothing happens, no sound, and the house battery gauge goes from just under 14 to just above zero or so. Simpson-Lawrence Sprint 600. The switch is next to the helm. Behind the helm chair is a stand-alone heavy duty circuit breaker with a red button. (Seadog line or something like that)? The breaker does not trip when I toggle the switch, but I think it has in the past. Any ideas about what's wrong?

The boat has twin 90's and twin starter batteries and a house battery. I wanted to attach pictures of the battery switch arrangement, but I don't know how to upload photos on this forum (or anywhere else). The house battery switch sits between two VSR Voltage Sensitive Relay Modules. Below those three are two switches "port start" and "stbd start" separated by an "emerg parallel" switch. The switches are red oblongs that are turned to show a green v or a red v. Should the "emerg parallel" be left on or only turned on in a real "emerg?"
 
Just of the top of my head, it sounds like a failed battery--which cannot handle the load. If the windlass was stalled or jammed, then the breaker would trip.

Try combining both of the starting batteries, engines running and see if the windlass works with those two batteries.

Ask the moderators for an album.
 
Sounds like dirty (corroded) contacts somewhere. Start at the house battery, take each red wire off and clean them thoroughly with Emory cloth, work your way toward the windlass. Then repeat with the black ( ground wire) which should go through a bus bar near the stern. You shouldn't need to use the emerg parallel switch, that's normally used for a situation when one start battery gets too low and you can't get an engine started.

Keep us posted! It's usually a bad ground! :cry

Charlie
 
Just of the top of my head, it sounds like a failed battery--which cannot handle the load. If the windlass was stalled or jammed, then the breaker would trip.

Try combining both of the starting batteries, engines running and see if the windlass works with those two batteries.

Ask the moderators for an album.
 
If the engines are running and the starting batteries are in emergency parallel, how does that help if the windlass is connected to the house battery?
 
If the starting batteries are in parallel and the windlass still doesn't work, what batteries need to be replaced. All of the voltage meters seem to indicate they are fine.
 
I would get out a volt meter and start checking the switch, breaker and leads. Make sure everything is getting power. Also check the windlass for free movement. In my old Sprit 600, the gear box locked up (the grease turned to peanut butter), the motor was full of seawater. But it would never trip a breaker.
 
Had similar problem on my first TC. I didn't have a relay in the system for the windlass and the up/down switch was corroded inside. Replaced it once and it worked for awhile and then intermittently and then not at all. Added a relay to handle the heavy current (much like a solenoid on a car starter) and it worked fine ever after! There is a diagram in one of the forums, I'll look for it.

OK, HERE'S THE THREAD which includes my saga and the diagram for the solenoid I installed. Some folks apparently never have problems, some are intermittent and some have them crap out entirely, which sounds like the problem you may be having. You can try taking that up/down switch out, I did several times, cleaned contacts and reinstalled. It would work for awhile, intermittently at other times and then fail. Full current is running through that little switch and sometimes really futzes things up! Just my 2c worth. Let us know what you end up doing.

KICKER DRB SAID "
I would get out a volt meter and start checking the switch, breaker and leads. Make sure everything is getting power. Also check the windlass for free movement. In my old Sprit 600, the gear box locked up (the grease turned to peanut butter), the motor was full of seawater. But it would never trip a breaker."

But, "getting power" (voltage), is not the same as "passing current" if the switch won't carry the load.



Charlie
 
If the problem is the switch, wouldn't toggling it have no impact on the volt meter? In my case, it definitely registers a change on the volt meter.
 
Maybe the windless is jammed or the windless's motor is locked. I myself would try using a set of jumper cables and a known good battery and jump power directly to the windless. Manually turn the windless to pull out some rode so the direction it runs in won't matter when you test. This will also let you know if the sucker is jammed. If the windless runs you have a starting point. If it does not you have an answer the windless is toast and needs to be rebuilt. If the windless does run you will to work backwards till you find the problem. Make sure you have safety glasses and gloves on when you do the jumper cable routine.
D.D.
 
Got a new house battery (cabin electronics were weird this morning and the volt meter at the helm said zero). Went out salmon fishing. Flicked the windlass toggle switch and the house battery meter went to zero and all of the interior electronics stopped working. Engines still running, but no chart/fishfinder, no water pressure, etc. Heading back in. Portable volt meter says the new battery is fine. Ideas?
 
dread":95d45wdk said:
Got a new house battery (cabin electronics were weird this morning and the volt meter at the helm said zero). Went out salmon fishing. Flicked the windlass toggle switch and the house battery meter went to zero and all of the interior electronics stopped working. Engines still running, but no chart/fishfinder, no water pressure, etc. Heading back in. Portable volt meter says the new battery is fine. Ideas?
Click to expand...

Sounds like you popped the main breaker/fuse between the batteries and the rest of the electrical system. That can be non habit forming to your electronics. Check that breaker/fuse and either reset, or replace.

I think it was Dave D that said to disconnect the wires to your windlass, and put a battery directly to the proper terminals, using jumper cables (and caution). I would probably do that, too. My suspicion is that you've got a windlass that is either locked up or shorted internally, but it could also be a bad inline relay, a bad switch, or a really corroded connection somewhere in the circuit.

Personally, I use an anchor wench, but most of the time, she makes me get out on deck and pull the doggone thing myself. (Apologies to my bride for the cheesy humor!).
 
you have a bad ground some where. A cable is like a water hose. You have 12 gallons of water ( volts) at the opening of the hose (switch) until you turn on the spray nozzle. Then the volume of water goes to near zero because the water ( voltage) can not supply the hose with enough water ( voltage). Most likely because you have a blockage or kink in the hose ( bad connection or build up of crust on a connector some where in the circuit. )

I had this problem while installing my new refrigerator. Drove me nuts. I have 12.8 volts at the switch until I turned on the switch and it would drop to 2.4. A brand new connector I had just bought was covered on the inside with a white film or crust that you could barely see. Replaced the ring connector and it works great.

You have a bad ground or the motor is shot.
 
Latest installment: fished for a couple of hours at low trolling speed -- only one salmon -- with all electronics off, except the radio which seemed to be sort of half off half on. Then increased speed and headed back into SF Bay. In a couple of minutes the electronics came back on and the volt meter for the new house battery showed normal voltage. Worked all the way back to Berkeley. Handheld volt meter indicates that power is getting to the switch, so the problem is in the switch, the wires running from the switch to the windlass or in the windlass itself. Two suggestions that crew made (one a Ph.D. in non-electrical engineering) is inadequate grounding of the negative buss bar or a burned out windlass motor. All other suggestions highly welcome!
 
my lewmar winch has a manual lock that you can set which puts a pawl into the gear to keep the anchor from inadvertently lowering. Specifically to protect the thing while being towed. When that pawl is locked in place all running the winch switch will do is click and pop the circuit breaker.

Wild card off the wall thought for what it is worth.
 
If it's a vertical windlass, it has most likely gotten water in it past the top seal and the gearbox has frozen up. Replace it with a horizontal windlass and eliminate the problem. You'll need a spacer to complete the change.



P1010083.jpg
 
Unfortunately since none of us are there, it is very difficult to know exactly how your boat is wired, and where the point of failure is. If there was a dead short--then there should be a 40 to 60 amp circuit breaker (which you described in the first post--and that would immediately pop, if the circuit were shorted-such as a frozen armature in the motor.

We don't know if you have a reversing relay, or if the switch is carrying full current, and that contacts may be bad there.

If you put the windlass leads directly to the motor, as suggested, and the motor turns, then the motor should be OK (maybe not perfect). What is puzzling is that apparently you are applying power, causing basically a dead short--or at least very low voltage, yet not popping a breaker--that is not right.

If there is corrosion anywhere--ground or positive, side, it will lower the voltage (current limited also).

So, your trouble shooting, is windlass leads directly to the battery. Check all connections for corrosion. Check any switch for function, and being able to carry the full current load of the windlass.
 
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