The future of salmon in Puget Sound

Posting mostly to be subscribed to this thread. My pessimism reached what I thought was its nadir about 2000, largely global warming projections. Technology does offer the hope of restoring salmon, control climate and good population control (no compulsion). But it requires a political will that I do not think our specie possesses.

Here in Kitsap county we have restored any number of streams. As a small peninsula they are all short. This involves culvert and bridge rebuilding, restoring some streamside conservation lands, changing channelising back to more meandering, pools, ripples etc. The results are, as I have mentioned before, almost magical. Salmon appear.

We can do it, we can do it all. But will we?
 
I have a friend who lives along a small creek that empties into Discovery Bay. A few years ago they were counting 3-400 salmon. Two years ago it was just under 100. Last year it was only 6. Given the cyclic nature of the counts, this next year is going to be very telling, as the peak seems to be every 3 years.

They planted some fertilized salmon eggs into the stream last fall hoping to supplement the original fish eggs there and increase the return. This is part of a small Christian school biology project.

Harvey
SleepyC :moon

1_10_2012_from_Canon_961.highlight.jpg
 
http://nwsportsmanmag.com/headlines/

WDFW REFUTES WILD FISH CONSERVANCY’S LATEST ATLANTIC SALMON CLAIMS

its the third article down the page. WFC is a anti fishing group that does NOT want to recover the runs to a point that you or anyone else gets to fish. I have talked to them years ago and they emitted just that to me " off the record" quoting this group is like quoting peta on how to bring back hunting. It is sad that the state has moved to get rid of a industry based on lies and mis information for votes, when we have a chance to work with the industry to come up with really science based solutions that work for everyone. but hey its fing Washington state , what else would you expect. If you feel other wise I really no longer care. Pm me if you most. [/url]
 
"Thinking without awareness is the main dilemma of human existence."

Forgot who said this but I like it as it seems to apply to history since
'homo sapiens' have been around.

The fish are lucky. They don't realize what's going on.
Aye.
 
Cooke's PR during this whole period has been a little brain dead. They have pumped out misinformation. Rather than inform the state about problems at their various sites and explain corrections happening, they have waited (?) for regulators to inspect and cite them. Surely they must have been aware that citizens generally did not hold a favorable view of fish pens. Another likely problem is that profit margins were too thin, but that is not the state's problem.
 
Following is an excerpt from an email I recieved recently from Wild Fish Conservancy:

"WFC announces summer lecture series on Atlantic salmon net pens.
Summer lecture series presented by Wild Fish Conservancy Director Kurt Beardslee on Atlantic salmon net pens and their residual implications for Chinook salmon and killer whale recovery. This is a new campaign to educate the public about a debilitating and potentially lethal salmonid virus remaining in Puget Sound Atlantic salmon net pens that cannot be ignored until 2022.

Join WFC director Kurt Beardslee for a public discussion on PRV (Piscine Reovirus) in Puget Sound.

Kurt will explain what recent science reveals about the virus and how exposure to PRV-infected farmed fish places our native salmonids at risk, as well as the implications for the Northwest's endangered Southern Resident Killer whales. He’ll review the results of recent PRV-testing in Puget Sound farmed Atlantic salmon and and what these results suggest about the potential scale of infection in the remaining net pens.

Kurt will also discuss Our Sound, Our Salmon’s efforts to stand in solidarity with B.C. First Nations as they petition the Canadian government to remove PRV-infected fish farms from their ancestral waters. Finally, learn all about Our Sound, Our Salmon’s new campaign to ensure PRV-infected farmed Atlantic salmon are removed from Puget Sound and how you can get involved to support these efforts. Each presentation will be followed by a Q and A.

If you are interested, check out the Wild Fish Conservancy web site for PNW meeting times and places near you.

Harvey
SleepyC :moon
 
RobLL":nvts93cj said:
Not exactly a joke, but shouldn't we be eating some of those Sea Lions?
Click to expand...

http://mynorthwest.com/1066485/dori-pinnipeds-orca-salmon/

Read this one. This is his argument; that seals & sea lions must be culled. Now he is a well known fisher"person"...but he is also a well respected biologist with the education to back his argument.

This fact is very telling:
"Converting juvenile Chinook salmon into adult equivalents, we found that by 2015, pinnipeds consumed double that of resident killer whales and six times greater than the combined commercial and recreational catches,” the authors’ abstract reads.
 
AstoriaDave":3puak7b6 said:
localboy":3puak7b6 said:
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-017-14984-8
Click to expand...
This is very interesting. One nugget: Orcas consume more tonnage than harbor seals, but harbor seals consume a greater number of individual fish. Another: consumption by natural predators has risen substantially since 1975, while consumption by fisheries has fallen dramatically.

Good to see some hard data on this. Thanks, Mark.
Click to expand...

You're welcome. :thup
 
Well, I don't fish but I drew several conclusions from reading this thread:

1. This is a multifaceted problem.

2. The root appears to be climate change and warming of the waters.

3. Lots of appreciation of science demonstrating effects but little for the cause.
 
If you all can stand a bit of humor: It has become illegal by states' laws as well as some federal laws against eating dogs and horses. Meantime we get outraged by India forbidding eating beef.

I also wondered why the homeless in Seattle don't eat all those pesky sh***ing Canadian Geese. But I digress! I suppose if someone could end up all that 'specie-ism' someone else would claim the right to reintroduce cannibalism.

Makah Indians have been refused permits to hunt even a few Gray Whales every several years. And the political fallout if they did would likely be harmful. I took a fair amount of grief supporting occasional whale hunting. About 5 years later hundreds(?) of Grays died of starvation, but I guess that is OK.

No one is willing to take on Sea Lions, and I understand. From what I hear they may not taste that great. But does anyone actually know?
 
Man "protects" pinnipeds. Pinnipeds multiply like rabbits and eat most of the salmon. Orca starve. Man is told he can't fish, even though what he takes is miniscule compared to pinnipeds. And he probably soon can't drive a boat in specific areas. Should man cull pinnipeds, feed starving Orca? I mean, we already "raise" artificial salmon in labs...hmmm...

SCIENCE!!! :roll:
 
RobLL":1yfh70nm said:
No one is willing to take on Sea Lions, and I understand. From what I hear they may not taste that great. But does anyone actually know?
Click to expand...

Yes. Not sea lions, but seals. I would guess that they taste the same. Decades ago I spent part of a summer living next to a Makah elder. He claimed (right or wrong) that he had the authority to harvest seals despite the new Marine Mammal Protection Act of 1972. He carried a 30.06 in his little kicker boat when out salmon fishing.

If you have ever eaten a cormorant or a merganser, you will have had the experience. Cormorant looks like duck, but tastes like greasy fish. Seal looks like beef, but tastes like greasy fish. People who find it disgusting are probably having the reaction similar to thinking that you are drinking water but it is milk. YUCK. Because it is not what you expected, it is bad. Actually, fishy beef really is an acquired taste even if you are prepared for the unexpected.

When he came home with a seal, it was obvious. He practically vibrated up the beach to get his bigger knife. Get that warm blubber before it cools. Even his son was disgusted.

Mark
 
I've come to realize our society eats too much of about everything.
Also, if hungry, I mean real hungry - say 3 weeks or so w/o food -
most would eat anything. I think there's proof of this out there;
rats, mice, snakes, gators, bugs. After that, what's a fish eating bird?
Even another human (first, check local and federal laws)?

Moreover, it seems true after watching several episodes of "Naked
and Afraid".

As far as 'acquired taste' goes, I go thru that each time I change coffee
brands.

Aye.
Grandma used to say, "We do not live by bread alone."
 
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