Towing with the short Tahoe

W

Wanderer

New member
Does anyone tow long distances with the short Tahoe? If so, are the results satisfactory? Mine is a 2001 5.3L V8 with the factory installed hitch rated for 5000 lbs and 500 lbs tongue weight. My new CD22 Cruiser has the 90 HP Honda with two Group 31 AGM batteries under the splash well. For my test drive, I had 10 gallons of fuel and 10 gallons of water. Little else on board.

Today I took the test ride on the highway. Between 50 and 70 MPH, the trailer sways when I change lanes or round a curve. When I straighten out, the swaying dies away. When I tow with my 26 foot RV on a Ford E450 chassis, I get no sway. Does the extra wheel base and weight make such a dramatic difference? If so, which is more important?

The trailer is rated 4900 GVW and weighs some 1100 pounds – leaving 3800 pounds for the boat. Load-Rite says the tongue weight should be between 5 and 7% of the boat and trailer weight. So, if boat and trailer weight 4000 lbs my tongue weight should be between 200 and 280 lbs. Mine is 325 lbs.

If the trailer is loaded correctly, will the short Tahoe work? My first trip will be 1300 miles to the Florida Keys.

Thanks for any insights.

George
 
Wanderer-

There's obviously a big difference between your RV and your Tahoe, and both wheelbase and weight play a real role in quieting any swaying tendencies. The 325 lb tongue wight is a little over 8%, but not so heavy as to cause problems unless the tow rig is otherwise undersized.

Your Tahoe is probably both somewhat short and light, and a number of factors could be contributing to the problem.

As far as the tow vehicle weight goes, remember when mobile homes were towed around commercially by short, heavy. gas tractor rigs? Add some weight to the rear of your Tahoe over the axle and see what effect it has. Try 300-400 lbs and see what the effect is experimentally.

Is the trailer tongue level or pitched up or down? Being off significantly either way will help induce sway. Get the correct drop/rise draw bar to level it up if necessary.

Is the trailer a single or tandem axle? Tandems sway less, inherently. Unfortunately, adding an axle is not an easy solution, but could be done.

Do you have radial or conventional tires on the trailer? Radial tires last longer and have a better grip on the road, but conventional tires with their bias ply side walls resist swaying more. Keep the tire pressures up to the recommended full load pressures to stiffen the side walls.

How about your tow vehicle tires? Be sure they're inflated fully.

How are your shocks? Heavy duty adjustable air boosted rear shocks and good stiff front ones will go a long way toward quieting sway tendencies.

You could change the tongue weight most easily by shifting the boat back a little on the trailer if the bunks will easily accommodate it by repositioning the bow post backward. Try moving it back a foot to 18 inches and test the tongue weight to see if it comes down to within the desired range. Move it further aft or back forward accordingly, if possible.

Another solution would involve the addition of an anti-sway bar to the rear of the Tahoe. Here you need help from someone familiar with that vehicle.

I know I have probably left out something, but there will be a number of other posts on this topic so that all the bases will be covered. Good luck. Joe.
 
George, we talked this subject on the phone at some length last week. If the Tahoe is loaded, with more weight on the rear, it should eliminate the problem. Go buy about 500# of cat litter and about 40 cats :shock: and try it again. If you need it to go away with no load, a sway control should solve the problem. You can see several options at

http://www.campingworld.com/browse/cate ... bOf=37,338]

Let us know how it goes. When are you headed south?

Keep in touch.

Charlile
 
:arrow: Sea Wolf

Thanks for the response. This morning I hauled the boat to the Load Rite dealer everyone says is the ‘man’. My trailer is a tandem. Starting with a tongue weight of 300 pounds, he drove the rig on the highway and observed the sway, returned, changed the tongue weight to 240 lbs and tried again. No better. Came back, increased the tongue weight to 400 lbs. Tried again. Worse. Towed the boat with his ¾ ton Avalanche. Much better. Lowered the ball 2 inches and changed tongue weight back to 300 and tried again with the Tahoe. Same as original results. He and I both concluded that the wheel base on the Tahoe is marginal and that the suspension system is too soft and that maybe it doesn’t weigh enough. Dave even questioned whether the ½ ton Suburban has a stiff enough suspension although the greater wheel base would surely help.

As an aside: Dave, the owner of Dave’s Trailers, spent 5 hours with me, made 5 road trips, had 4 different people working on the rig, had the boat in slings twice and would not let me pay him more than $50; since he didn’t solve the problem. It’s enough to give one faith in the human race.

I haven’t tried the weight over the axel yet. I am looking into the AirLift 1000. It is an air bag that is supposed to stiffen the suspension. Do you know anything about their effectiveness?

I find it hard to believe that everyone out there with a CD22 Cruiser is towing long haul with a ¾ ton truck or better. However, I’ve not seen anyone here claim successful use of the standard Tahoe.

:arrow: Charlie,

Thanks for the response. I did look into sway bars. Both Jiffy Hitch and Dave’s Trailers say that sway bars cannot be used with a trailer having an actuator since the distance from ball to attachment point is not constant.

I haven’t weighed the rig yet. But, I think it is well inside the 5000# rating stamped on the trailer hitch. The boat is dry weight plus no more than 20 gallons of fluid. I find it hard to understand how Chevy would make a claim so far out of line with performance. I bought the Tahoe not quite four days ago with the stated purpose of towing a package under 5000 lbs. The Tahoe is used but certified by Chevy.

I wonder if it satisfies the fundamental warranty-suitability for purpose intended?

George
 
George, it's radical but you could always convert to electric brakes (and/or disk conversion if you don't have them) and then you could use the sway braces. Did you try loading the tow vehicle?

We seem to be creating lots of problems for you....sorry.


Charlie
 
George,

There are stabilizing bars that work on our brakes... somewhere in the archives for our goody stuff Bill has the topic tucked away. I'm not smart enough to find the thread.

Dusty
 
And there are lots of things that contribute to the sway/instability problem. Radial tires, low tire pressures, etc. I had to put a swaybar on the back of one tow vehicle -- but that was years ago. Because your boat tows okay with one tow vehicle, I'd make sure the tires are at max recommended pressures... etc. Don't know your vehicle, but it should have some sort of aft sway control.

Dusty, who sways all the time.
 
Hi George, I tow with a Dodge Ramcharger. Weighs about 5600#. Similar to a Chevy Blazer. Adeline weighs about 4500# fully loaded. Single axle. I get dramatically more sway as my speed gets above 55 m.p.h.. Also when a Semi-Truck passes me. I believe wheelbase is the largest factor. My brother's Suburban tows our sled trailer much better than the Dodge. I looked into sway control and was most impressed with the "Equalizer" system here http://www.equalizerhitch.com/home.html. Ultimately, I did'nt think the problem was severe enough for sway control. I've adapted. As I recall, Mark Toland (past C-Dory president) said he towed with a Chevy S-10 pickup. Good Luck, Pete
 
Wanderer,

I'd like to caution you regarding your towing combination. I don't know the weight of your Tahoe or your exact configuration. The short wheelbase of your Tahoe connected to the long trailer and probably tandem axles on the boat trailer is very dangerous. I suspect the weight of the boat & trailer exceeds the weight of the towing vehicle. Alot of the weight on your boat is located at the transom (engine, fuel tanks, etc).

The radial tires on your Tahoe are designed to flex and absorb sideways motion under normal driving conditions (w/o the trailer). IF you also have radial tires on your trailer, the problem, which I will address, is compounded.

Let's say a large set of doubles (a big truck with trailers) approaches from the rear in a passing movement. He is pushing a huge column of air which at first hits your trailer pushing the back of it to the right and the front of your Tahoe also is pushed to the right by the tongue of your trailer. As the big truck passes your trailer swings back in the vacuum left by the truck. This will result in the front of your Tahoe swinging way back to the left and you'll be looking straight at those BIG wheels on the last trailer of the doubles as they pass. You will then need to make the next potty stop.

Bill (retired CHP)
 
George: I had a 97 Tahoe with 8000# towing capacity. Yes, it is a short, light vehicle. I did add the air lift bags on the back, to include the on board compressor with the gauge, pump it up button, let it down button mounted at the bottom of the dash down and back behind the ashtray and above the hump between the bucket seats. Looked good and was functional even going down the road. I towed my TomCat and yes it still swayed...but, much less after the bags on back. Good air pressure in all tires. Notice where your "onboard" weight is for a long haul in both the Tahoe and the boat. You can easily shift a couple hundred pounds around and change things no mater where your axle weight is. What you can not change is the frame set up of the Tahoe, or it's length. I think I spent about $350 on the bags and onboard compessor and about $400 getting the 2 systems installed. A lot of labor time here and whoever does the air bag portion, has to know how to use a tourch... I think your Tahoe whould pull it, and, you just have to watch that rearview for the 18 wheelers or those bus RVs going past at 70-80 mph. I guess what I am saying is that about $800 to make the trailer line level and boost the rear suspension is much cheaper than a new ride...and if you do not like the results... you tried.
 
Here's a web site that allows a person to compare vehicles on various criteria---the page as you will find it is set up to compare all current model SUV's as to wheelbase: (The various models of the Tahoe/Blazer have had a wheelbase from 111.5 to 117.5 over the years as best I can tell.)

http://www.theautochannel.com/newcardb/ ... eid=105806



You can change it to compare trucks, but the wheelbase of full sized trucks is not at issue.

For sure, the relative short wheelbase of the Tahoe is a major part of the problem, but don't some other people tow with vehicles of similar or shorter wheelbases without the full blown sway problem?
 
Hey Joe - thanks for that site. Now you went and made me have to throw in my 2¢.

We towed our CD22 with a single axle trailer all over the place with a Jeep Cherokee (V8, 6500# tow package). Never had a bit of trouble, sway or otherwise. I do believe Fishtales is still pulling his 22 with a Jeep. Looking at the list Joe found us, the Tahoe has a 10" longer wheelbase. It is also longer overall, wider, and heavier than the Jeep. Maybe there are some other factors working against George, that when corrected would put the footprint questions to rest.

Don't tell anyone, but we also towed the CD25 a few hundred miles with the Jeep. No problems with that, either, except the nervousness.
 
I tow a 25' behind a '03 Ford Expedition. Probably approximately the same wheel base as your Tahoe. It is rated to tow 8650 lbs with a weight distributing hitch. Les at EQ and I had several conversations about what hitch to use and finally settled on the Husky weight distributing hitch. The tow weight of my boat and trailer is around 7,000+ lbs. It works fine with the surge brakes, and I've never had any problem with sway.

Last Saturday I was towing the boat back from the Columbia at 60 mph and had a 30 mph side wind. A semi passed me on the upwind side and I braced myself for the effect as he passed. There was really no impact at all. I know few people use a weight distributing hitch with boat trailers, but I love mine. I've never had a feeling of lack of control in any condition while towing. I believe it cost around $225.00 for the hitch.
Lyle
 
I forgot to say that my Expedition has the factory air suspension which levels the vehicle in all conditions. That probably also contributes to the stability with the weight distributing hitch.
Lyle
 
Lyle,

Like your system... I've used the load equalizers for years, and also in combination with air bags and an on-board compressor. No sway. Never. Spendy, but worth it IMO. Had to put a Holiday Rambler and tow rig in the hillside to slow a badly swaying runaway once and have been chicken ever since.

Dusty
 
Here's another interesting data point...a longer wheelbase does not always mean less sway.

No question about it, my truck (F250 Standard Cab Long Bed) tows the boat better than my van (E350 Extended Body). With the truck, there is rarely a hint of sway, regardless of wind or load.

With the van, towing is not stressful, but the boat does occasionaly sway in more extreme conditions. And yet the van has the longer wheelbase, and has 1-ton suspension.

My theory on why this is...the distance between the hitch and the rear axle is greater on the van. The trailer is generating far more torque on the van, as the first point of significant resistance is the rear axle/rear suspension.
 
Bill,

I read an opinion on another web site that the load range of the tow vehicle's tires also has a great influence on the vehicle's ability to resist sway. For example, a load range "E" tire has ten plys and thicker sidewalls than a load range "D" with eight plys. Since you have the great fortune to have two tow vehicles, one of which sways less, does your 3/4 ton F250 have a higher load range tire than the one ton van?

My 3/4 ton short bed has a load range "E" tire and tows a wide variety of trailers very straight, the one challenge is that there are only two tires made that will fit it (265/70-17) with a load range "E". This severally limits my ability to "shop around" for either a good price or a better quality tire. I have repeatedly been told that dropping to a "D" rated tire will have a noticable negative impact on my ability to tow with sway being stated as one of those negatives.

"Chivita" Dave
 
This is Riverrat on Chinook

I towed for years a 4000 lb boat/trailer combo on a tandem axle surge brake trailer with an older (short) full size Jimmy. It was a '77, with a highway patrol package. Worked pretty well, but had stiff suspension and hard as rock tires. Went to a '92 K-3500 GMC with duals, same boat/trailer. World of difference, no sway ever. Of course, truck outweighed the boat by 2000 lbs. Also truck has Goodyear Workhorse All Terrain tires, load range E. Then went to an 8000 lb boat on a 900 lb aluminum trailer, triaxle, surge brakes 2 axles, same truck. Went with the load-equalizing hitch, which does work with surge brakes. Trailer & load outweighed truck by 3000 lbs. Towed it for five seasons, zero problems. Straight as an arrow, even semi's had little effect on it. It didn't make any difference how the tongue weight was arranged, I always leveled with the air shocks after hitching up.

I'm thinking your short wheelbase is the most likely culprit, compounded a lot by mushy ride, and probably pretty soft tires. If you were to try load range C or higher tires, antisway bar (check the bushings) and either airshocks or spring shocks, I think you would see noticeable improvement.
If this isn't enuf, go truck shopping.
 
All these comments about sidewall stiffness just take the arguments we made earlier about conventional versus radial tires and inflation pressure to a higher, but logically following, level. Who would want to have tires on the rear of their tow vehicle that are squishy and flimsy from side to side? That's what you get with radials, underinflation, etc.

Bill's point about the influence of the distance from the hitch pivot point to the rear axle in causing sway is also very well taken. Extend this idea to it's logical conclusion to minimize sway, and you get a 5th wheel trailer. Then double the side walls for increased sway resistance, and you have a dually rig. No soft tire side wander there! And with the 5th wheel hitch, the lever arm between the hitch and the rear end doesn't exist. Have you ever seen a really big boat trailer with three or four axles and a fifth wheel hitch? I think someone's already been there and done that (after figuring all this out!).

I have a fairly long tow bar on my Durango which could be shortened four or five inches, but since I have no sway, I think I'll just leave it alone as it helps prevent jackknifing and allows for tighter turns. I'll keep it in mind, though.

Someday, when time allows, we need to make a list of all those factors that contribute to towing stability and those that do the oposite. Joe.
 
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